ADELE

does ciggs and alcohol sound like the Beatles?
Does live forever sound like the Beatles.
Who is now reading and regurgitating what they read???
They like the Beatles but they are nothing like the Beatles in sound.
ask Jalen and he will tell you better then me.
Beatles nothing like Oasis.

Every song in the history of rock?
I think not.
Methinks you are been silly now and if there is one thing I don't like in this forum it is people who make sweeping statements that sound arrogant and do not hold up with any look at the facts!
he he.

Minstrel

A little exaggeration, but I think my point is clear...the "innovative" themes that you ascribe to Oasis are the themes that have characterized rock music since nearly its inception.

And, amusingly, those same themes were what Madchester were all about. Gee, wonder where Oasis got it? Noel Gallagher has said as much. "No Stone Roses, no Oasis.'

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"Blow your tuneless trumpet, the choice is yours / We don't want the glamour, the pomp and the drums / The Dublin messiah scattering crumbs"

ADELE

You do make a good point but making **** hot records when every other band is trying to do the same and actually suceeding makes you great.
it is like of all the boxers ali is best but they all are trying to be best by hitting each other.
That just makes them even better for actually doing it.
My view is some make it happen and others follow.
The pistols made us look up, Nivarna made us look up, elvis and berry etc.
They create a genre.
Then others follow.
that is a sign of genius to take something everyone is trying to do and make it great and new again.
you made my point well so thanks.

Minstrel

Which Oasis didn't do (nothing they did was "great and new again"), so I'm glad we all agree that they weren't genius.

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"Blow your tuneless trumpet, the choice is yours / We don't want the glamour, the pomp and the drums / The Dublin messiah scattering crumbs"

ADELE

come off your high horse man.
they did inspire the verve and other bands and their first two albums were great like live forever.
how many young people were at that time just tired of pruning their roses?
do you get it?
tired of pruning their roses?
I just came up with that as I wrote.
how come they sold out knebworth and created britpop?

Minstrel

Dear Kettle,

You're black.

Sincerely,
The Pot

They and Blur popularized Britpop, certainly. But they weren't particularly innovative or all that great.

I think their first two albums are quite good, enjoyable to listen to. They are far, far, far from the best albums produced in that era.

Well done.

They didn't create Britpop. That's how come. Suede and Teenage Fanclub created Britpop, if anyone. You can include the Roses, if you count the Madchester scene. Blur and Oasis made it mainstream (despite being significantly worse bands).

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"Blow your tuneless trumpet, the choice is yours / We don't want the glamour, the pomp and the drums / The Dublin messiah scattering crumbs"

ADELE

so you do have some spunk in you young urban!
ahhhhhh haaaaaa haaaaaa haaaaaaa haaaaaa

teenage fanclub are okay but you will lose credibilty on this forum if you really think that about them.
were they manc bands?
Britpop was blur oasis.
Credibilty like mine comes from sustained beliefs and well constructed arguements that stay the same.
Not saying whatever seems right at each juncture.
Teenage fanclub are not without their charm.
But you could say Ride were part of it or loads of other bands around at the time even the manics.
but we all know the real fuel of britpop.
still you do make some good points.
I enjoy disecting your arguements alot.
But your views on oasis been nothing is very how can I say, here and now as they are still going.
In a few years you'll be loving them.
I love the roses the smiths and oasis and the mondays.
But influential on the manc scene of the early nineties I would say it was actually ryders mondays because they put manchester on the music map properly.
I would say influential to media is mondays.
Influential to music and other bands oasis.
keep up the debate and remember I am only joking man. But my points about bands I really believe.

Minstrel

I'll argue what I see. Suede and Teenage Fanclub were the first to start making that sort of music. (Again, unless you count Stone Roses...some consider them part of Britpop, some don't.)

No, but you used "created Britpop" as an argument for Oasis. They didn't create Britpop. Non-Manchester bands did.

In the mainstream. They weren't the originators or the best.

I'm saying what I see as right based on my perspective. What part of my perspective comes up depends on where the discussion goes. Nothing I believe has changed for the sake of this discussion.

You could include Ride, MBV, Lush, Secret Shine, etc, if you count shoegaze as part of Britpop. I don't, and I don't think most do. It was quite a different sound.

Teenage Fanclub didn't find a lot of fame and mainstream success, but they were one of the most respected UK bands among the British bands in that scene and they made a ton of great songs. More to the point, they and Suede were the ones to start the brand of guitar pop / power pop that was the foundation of Britpop in the '90s.

I didn't say they were nothing. They made some good pop. They just didn't innovate (no crime) and weren't among the best (in my opinion, and also no crime).

Unlikely. I liked them when they started and have liked their work less and less over the years. I thought their first two albums were great when they came out, now I barely listen to them. I don't think their music has lasting appeal.

I realize you're not being very serious. I am also keeping things light. None of this is annoying me.

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"Blow your tuneless trumpet, the choice is yours / We don't want the glamour, the pomp and the drums / The Dublin messiah scattering crumbs"

ADELE

You have won this discussion my man!
I know you have.
Your points are right.
One thing I would say though is that the mondays were most influential to manchester with maybe the roses second.
My title was about influential from manchester. I reckon in hindsight even though the mondays were short lived like their shows they were the crest of that high scene. The roses not so much purely because they were not connected to wilsons club there.
The smiths get bussloads of americans who vist the working mans club from the pictures and they put mancs on the map but for me the mondays from 88 to 91 ish made madchester what it was.
But your points about britpop are right and I am wrong.
But don't you think that those earlier bands didn't really light the fuse much.
I think it was the BRITS where they really got going with that blur oasis thing and their two singles combined release crap.
But for me like I said I think the mondays encapsulate manchester's finest moment.
So I would say they were most influential been tied to wilsons club.

jackhammer

ADELE. Why don't you actually get out there and hear some new bands instead of rehashing arguments that are well past their sell by date? Just a thought....

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