I don't think I could've summed it up any better myself

I don't think Dirty Pretty Things are terrible, and can't say anything about Babyshambles though.

such a sad story...I like their 2nd album a lot, but Up the Bracket is f'ing fantastic! Everytime I hear it, I want to get wasted and break furniture..

OK lets compare the lyrics of Pete Doherty to Alex Turner.

Pete Doherty

Time For Heroes

did you see the stylish kids in the riot
we were shovelled up like muck
set the night on fire
wombles bleed truncheons and shields
you know i cherish you my love

but there's a rumour spread nasty disease around town
caught round the houses with your trousers down
a headrush in the bush
you know i cherish you my love
how i cherish you my love

what can you want now you've got it all
she says it's obscene
time will strip it away
a year and a day
and bill bones
bill bones he knows what i mean

yes it's eating no it's chewing me up
it's not right for young lungs to be coughing up blood
oh it's all
it's all in my hands
and its all up the walls

the stale chips are up and the hopes stakes are down
it's these ignorant faces that bring this town down
yeah i sighed and sunken with pride
you know passed myself down on my knees
yes i passed myself down on my knees

what can you want now you've got it all
she says it's obscene
time will strip it away
a year and a day
and bill bones, he knows what i mean

there are fewer more distressing sights than that
of an englishman in a baseball cap
yeah we'll die in the class we were born
that's a class of our own my love
we're in a class of our own my love

did you see the stylish kids in the riot
we were shovelled up like muck
then set the night on fire
wombles bleed truncheons and shields
you know i cherish you my love
oh how i cherish you my love

versus

Alex Turner

I bet that you look good on the dancefloor

Stop making the eyes at me
I'll stop making the eyes at you
And what it is that suprises me
Is that I don't really want you to
And your shoulders are frozen (cold as the night)
Oh, but you're an explosion (you're dynamite)
Your name isn't Rio, but I don't care for sand
Lighting the fuse might result in a bang, with a bang-go!

I bet that you look good on the dancefloor
I don't know if you're looking for romance, or
I don't know what you're looking for
I said I bet that you look good on the dancefloor
Dancing to electro-pop like a robot from 1984
From 1984!

I wish you'd stop ignoring me
Because you're sending me to despair
Without a sound, yeah, you're calling me
And I don't think it's very fair
That your shoulders are frozen (colder than night)
Oh, but you're an explosion (you're dynamite)
Your name isn't Rio, but I don't care for sand
Lighting the fuse might result in a bang, with a bang-go!

I bet that you look good on the dancefloor
I don't know if you're looking for romance, or
I don't know what you're looking for
I said I bet that you look good on the dancefloor
Dancing to electro-pop like a robot from 1984
From 1984!

Oh, there ain't no love, no Montagues or Capulets
Just banging tunes and DJ sets
And dirty dancefloors and dreams of naughtiness!

I bet that you look good on the dancefloor
I don't know if you're looking for romance, or
I don't know what you're looking for
I said I bet that you look good on the dancefloor
Dancing to electro-pop like a robot from 1984
From 1984!


AND

Pete Doherty

The Good Old Days

Queen Boadicea is long dead and gone.
Still now the sprit in her children’s children’s children lives on.

And if you've lost your faith and love of music oh the end wont be long.
Because if its come then I too may loose it and that would be wrong.

I've tried so hard to keep myself from falling back to my bad old ways,
and it chars my heart to always hear you calling,
calling for the good old days,
'cos there were no good old days,
these are the good old days.

It’s not about tenements and needles,
or all the evils in the eyes and the backs of their minds

Daisy chains and schoolyard games, and a list of things we said we'd do tomorrow, a list of things we said we'd do tomorrow.

The arcadian dream, so fallen through
But the Albion sails on course
Let's man the decks and hoist the rigging.
Because the pig mans found the source,
And there’s twelve rude boys on the oars.
They’re singing "row row row"

Versus

Alex Turner

Mardy Bum

Now then Mardy Bum
I see your frown
And it's like looking down the barrel of a gun
And it goes off
And out come all these words
Oh there's a very pleasant side to you
A side I much prefer
It's one that laughs and jokes around
Remember cuddles in the kitchen
Yeah, to get things off the ground
And it was up, up and away
Oh, but it's right hard to remember
That on a day like today when you're all argumentative
And you've got the face on

Well now then Mardy Bum
Oh I'm in trouble again, aren't I
I thought as much
Cause you turned over there
Pulling that silent disappointment face
The one that I can't bare

Can't we laugh and joke around
Remember cuddles in the kitchen
Yeah, to get things off the ground
And it was up, up and away
Oh, but it's right hard to remember
That on a day like today when you're all argumentative
And you've got the face on

Yeah I'm sorry I was late
Well I missed the train
And then the traffic was a state
And I can't be arsed to carry on in this debate
That reoccurs ,oh when you say I don't care
Well of course I do, yeah I clearly do!

So laugh and joke around
Remember cuddles in the kitchen
Yeah, to get things off the ground
And it was up, up and away
Still it's right hard to remember
That on a day like today when you're all argumentative
And you've got the face on

If you read the above post and still think Alex Turner writes better songs then Pete Doherty than you're retarded or an AM fan boy. High school poetry students can write with more meaning then Alex Turner.

And irritating scruffy no talent smack heads too?

Drugs do give inspiration...look at Herion by the Velvet Underground.

"taking drugs to make music take drugs" - Spacemen 3

look at every song Bardo Pond ever made :)

Waiting for the Man- Velvet Underground (song about buying herion)
White Light/White Heat-Velvet Underground
(song about speed)

nuff said...

In your eyes who exactly is talented? If you believe Pete Doherty has no talent, facetious as you may have been when you said that, then you've got serious delusions. Even before he became an 'irritating scruffy no talent smack head' he was an extremely bright student and had won competitions because of his poetry. Does that not constitute as talented?

Serious delusions?

I've HEARD a Babyshambles album. They sound like nothing more than a pub band with a pissed singer.

As an example, I find Bjork's music irritating, completely self-indulgent and pointless. I can still admit she has talent, however much I dislike her music.

Can I state that I think Pete Doherty is a complete prick who is abusing his copious amounts of talent, but that's the point, he still does have talent. How you could deny that after reading his lyrics and poetry is bewildering.

Lyicly, Alex Turner doesn't really compare to Pete Doherty
However, consistancy wise, the Arctic Monkeys are a far stronger band then the Libs

Because his lyrics and poetry aren't good.

And the Shins are better than the Artic Monkeys. I started this thread to talk about the Libs not make fun of Pete's drug problem or his lyrics. If your not a fan than don't post. :(

Yeah. See, like, you might find this difficult to understand, but the intention of Turner's lyrics is not really to be "deep" and "meaningful". It's supposed to be entertaining and humorous.

I'm not an AM fan-bwoi. Cripes, I haven't listened to them in almost a year. But I can't avoid the need to point out that there IS a difference between Turner and somebody like Doherty. See, Alex Turner knows his limits. He has no grand pretentions about being a poet or some important cultural figure. He knows what he CAN do well, and sticks to his strengths. Pete on the other hand is this complete twonk who tries to be "relevant". *chuckle*. Poet my rear-end. Pete's writings have no political significance nor are they particularly insightful in terms of social commentary. In fact they're the typical bland issues that people have been talking about for years.

What irritates me the most about Libs fan-bwois - which is actually what you are, btw (loz, the irony!) - is that they are in no position to be thinking so highly of Doherty! The guy can hardly play his instrument; he evidently knows almost nothing about that whole songcraft thingee which is often kinda important to making good music; and then, when it comes to the one thing he does know how to do (i.e. lyrics), he's not even that good. He's hit and miss. Sometimes winners, sometimes duds - but almost never culturally significant! This guy isn't a musician. This guy isn't a 21st century Keats. He's a complete chaotic mess of an individual, about as much worth being idolized as he is being in a band with - which, suffice to say, is not very much at all.

I agree, Pete is a terrible musician. I agree, the majority of his output doesn’t deserve anywhere near the coverage it receives. No, I don’t think he is a significant poet and not much of his stuff compares to actual acclaimed poets. Maybe if you had of actually read the thread before you ran your keyboard you would of seen I was responding to claims he has no talent and that Alex Turner has “more talent in his fingernails.”

And have you actually listened to any sort of amount of his discography? Obviously not, because you have missed a common theme in many of his songs about racism, poverty, domestic oppression and police violence. I don’t think Pete Doherty is anywhere near as good as what he is made out to be, but it just pisses me that people feel the need to hijack any thread about him to proclaim his lack of ability. It shouldn’t be too difficult to comprehend that some people may see some artistic value in his music.

Nobody is hijacking anything.

This is a thread to discuss The Libertines , not a thread to hero worship Pete Doherty.

I do love it how some people seem to think he's some sort of genius. As if the very notion that releasing one OKish album in 2002 and nothing else of any interest makes you one.

Look out Hendrix , Zappa , Bowie , Morrissey ... Pete's gonna show you what a real genius is :laughing:

Do you think Pete and Carl will get back together. And is it just me or did they seem kindof romanticly involved with one another.

Farking hell. Point out where I called him a genius? I said he was a guy with talent who was wasting it. My comments were in response to people who hijacked the thread to push their own agenda. I even said the majority of his output isn't very good. That he's a prick. That he isn't anywhere near as good as what a lot of people make out. That's hero worship eh?

I don't know why you're still going, I agree with the majority of what you say but it seems you feel real powerful out of having a go at people on an internet forum.

Get over yourself.

Goddamn it, Am I the only one who wants to talk about the Libertines? :banghead:

Haha sorry mate. To tell you the truth, I don't think the Libertines will ever reform. Pete and Carlos certainly did have something emotionally special, but that would have to be pretty much lost now wouldn't you agree? Best we could hope for is a few more guest performances from Carl at Pete's solo shows.

Tbh I'm not sure it suits them right now either. Carl is supposedly going down a completely different track with the DPT away from stock standard guitar rock and I'm not sure Pete's ego would allow him to go back to the way things were.

i bought 'What A Waster' when it came out because the NME told me to, I gave it away a couple of years ago and I'm sort of regretting it now. Meh

I like DPT. But I wish I new about the Libs when they were still around.... I just wish they would realese one more album, I really liked the way they were heading.

Only the point about hijacking the thread was aimed at you. The rest of it was my experience of fans of Pete Doherty in general

Fair enough. I know why you would feel so sinister about someone defending Pete Doherty, the average fan would blabber on about how he is the greatest song writer since Dylan :crazy: I'm in no way a fan of Pete Doherty, though I loved the Libertines first album and bits of their second.

I don't understand why I seem to be the only one in love with their second album.

Becasue their second was basically ****,
Save for a couple of goods songs
But didn't even compare with the first one

I don't think the Libertines will ever get back together
to release another album
Nor do I think that they ever should
It wouldnt be the same

Anyway, why the heck should a very close relationship of male bonding somehow automatically equate to homoeroticism?

this shows that it wasn't **** liz
(skip the lord of the rings commercial)

that was just something I read about them.

I would love to see what the rest of the list was like then
If that album made it to number 50

(The Lord of The Rings commercial at the beginning made me laugh though) :)

I read that somewhere too actually
Probably not true though

The list isn't bad I mean the beatles made #1.
And I belived the romour for a bit after seeing them preform can't stand me now....just the way they looked at each other and not the crowd caught my attention.

I even rate Waterloo to Anywhere and Down in Albion above that album. It just wasn't very good, and putting it 50 in the greatest albums of all time is not only a travesty but insulting to Up the Bracket.

I guess i'm the only one that apperciates their second album.

Yeah mate, it's bare comedy to be putting something like the Libertines' second outing in a best 50 albums list of 2004, let alone all of rock history. And yeah, definitely a joke considering Up The Bracket was so much stronger. I mean, the second album had so few real hooks it was embarrassing. A bewilderingly shocking exhibition of disastrous, uninspired songcraft not improved in the slightest by a endless series of pointless guitar solos.

that's it i'm going to write a review on their second album and show it's great and underrated!

Good luck. Making The Libertines' eponymous piece of garbage sound good will take some cutting edge skill.

I can do it, and you all are going to love it. :bringit: