Do you know the definition of the word contempt?
That might be a handy bit of information to have to aid in the comprehension of my post. Just a thought.

If you really have a problem with racism you shouldn't be trying to make a point against some guy that used a few insults and look at the bigger picture, and people that are actually racist.

Just sayin'

What makes Michael Richards different from people that "actually are racist"?
Who says Michael Richards isn't "actually racist".

I think that a guy using tons of racial epithets and references to lynching towards a black man is a pretty clear sign of racism.

I`m aware of what you said.But eariler on you said this....

So in other words what your saying is if a black guy calls another black guy that in a arguement (and I have heard it happen) that it somehow doesn`t become a abusive term yet if a white guy does it`s racist.

And thats why i`m saying it`s a load of rubbish.

A black guy would not call another black in an argument a "******" in an attempt to belittle him.
You saying you have heard it happen is bullsh*t and I do not believe you. THAT is why I am saying your argument is "rubbish"

In the situation that a black man would call another black a ****** in an argument it would once again be in the same sense that he may use dude, man, or in your case "mate" "chap" or "lad" which white people also use in arguments.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but in your last post, when you were again pointing out to me what post of mine you were referencing, you quoted the bit that I just referenced. When I showed you how what I said could be understood through the simple understanding of the word "contempt" you changed your mind and decided that you were ACTUALLY talking about a post that I made 3 pages ago? That doesn't make much sense, make up your mind.

I don`t agree with that but let me play devils advocate here...

Why wouldn`t they use it?

Because it has racist connections which was my original point.

The word "******" when used in contempt of another DOES have racist connections.
When used synonomously with "man" or "dude" it DOES NOT have racist connections.

A black person wouldn't use it in an attempt to belittle another black person simply because the word, (in a racial matter) is a blanket term for black people, which he would be. In saying it to belittle another he would belittle himself.

A situation like that would never arise which is why there is no need to decide whether or not it would be racism. It would never happen.

This is an isolated incident that he has apologized repeatedly for. It's not like he's a member of the NSM, who are really what people should be doing things about if they are so against racism.

He made one public apology in an attempt to save his broken career.

Oh wow. This guy must be such a bad guy. He apologizes about his actions. I be this guy goes home an puts a jump suit on so he can go and slay a few of dem black folk.

He didn't apologize because he was sorry.
He apologized 2 days later because he was pressured to.

You did know that the night after this situation happened he performed at the Laugh Factory AGAIN, simply because the owners thought he would apologize for his actions the previous night. He didn't, and they banned him from the club.

When a fuss was made about it he came out and did the typical "I'm not a racist and I'm sorry"

Bullsh*t, if he wasn't a racist he wouldn't have said it. People who don't harbour racist thoughts don't say things like he said. It doesn't happen.

When the day is done everyone will understand the only true comic is Richard Pryor.

"When I hear 'yee-haw!', that scare the shit outta me. Cuz I know what come next. Y'all remember? Y'all's ancestors used to hang us for kicks? ..Muthafuckin on the weekend (hot!! couldn't get no pussy..)? ..'Let's go down to the jail, get a couple of them black ones and just string 'em up. ..yeehaww..' ..When I hear that, shit crawl all up and down my neck."

ahh sorry, but you're wrong on this one....everybody can be a racist....

in my naive little mind, he was just tryin to crack a joke and failed horribly at it

i dunno if he's a racist or not but his reputation will never be the same after this

Back in the 20's, I'd agree with you.

But take a look at the situation now and try and tell me 90%+ of it is not self-imposed.

Blacks in this country are holding themselves back.

Two things. One, all of my black friends who don't use the word ****** tell me that lighter blacks look down on darker blacks. And I've seen it first hand, so it does happen.

The other is, the term racism does not imply power. The ****ing dictionary says "a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race"

Seems to me that racism is the belief that your descent/gentics make you a superior collective than another group. Once racism begins to be applied it becomes an evil (such as the Apartied).


Bottom line is this, Kramer is wrong. Kramer should pay for what he said, but having double standards for things like this fail. In response to the word ******, the word cracker was used. Tit for tat. This case will never hold up in court.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f3...up_nazi017.jpg

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f3...20Costanza.jpg

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f3...com_Kramer.jpg

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f3...dcharacter.jpg

T-Shirt Hell was on this pretty quick too:

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f3..._hell_a809.jpg

Yeah but it`s black

I think it was horrible what he said. There is no excuse .

He has a prefectly legitimate excuse.

It was Comedy.

With all due respect hate speech is not comedy.

A good percentage of comedy is Hate Speech in one form or another.

Just because he spoke about "Black people" he gets in the ass.
People insult Rednecks in Comedy a hell of a lot. And they don't get in any trouble.

I'm not saying I agree, but I don't think it should be such a huge issue.

No, everyone can have prejudice, but racism DOES require power to be exerted.

Think of it this was, is what makes a racist, racist, is the fact that he dislikes the other person because of their skin color, then the way to solve in would be for blacks to simply change their skin color, which has been attempted. This however, obviously solves nothing in the mind of a racist which proves that skin color is not what makes a racist, racist.

What makes a racism racism is the use of oppression to retain power. You cannot retain power if you don't have it in the first place.(Power here being used synonomously with majority) Whites are by far the majority in this country thus the ability to be racist applies exclusively to them.

Try reading beyon your websters dictionary, and look at the way your country's judicial system defines racism. I'll quote an article for you guys...again.

I'm not making sh*t up when I say that the definition of racism implies power, and I have read on these topics more than I could possibly describe. I'm guessing that people like you, RAR, haven't read about this, and are confusing prejudice with racism.

Cracker is not racist unless you are an immature child. Cracker means nothing and has no historical significance. I'll say it again that White Europeans are the only group of people in this country who have not faced oppression of any sort. Cracker doesn't mean anything and isn't reminicient of your oppression, or of discrimination against you. A white person is not capable of empathisizing with a black or a latino simply because they have never been part of a race that DOESN'T give them advantage over another race. This is called "White Privilage" which is a very popular theorem, and before you tell me that racism works both ways, look it up. Prejudice and racism are NOT the same thing.

My thoughts exactly. Most comedy is offensive in some way. Richard Pryor, Lenny Bruce you know the types. The ones that make good comedy.

From that I don't see how you have come to the conclusion that Kramer is racist. He didn't exert power over anyone.

Actually thats very true. And it wasn't so long ago I saw a black comedian making jokes about all arabs being terrorists, crowd went fucking nuts with laughter.

Kevin Bloody Wilson is a classic example.

He writes songs about "Abo's" etc and everyone loves the fool.

He didn't speak about black people. He humiliated two black people using lynching as a justification for why they shouldn't interrupt him. Also, redneck is not a race of people, black is. There is a difference.

That is classic prejudice bred from ignorance. If he had singled out two Arabs in his audience and baraded them with insults and was a public figure who is recognizable and well liked, just as big a fuss would have been made about it.

Read above post about "Abo's"

I honestly don't see what the big issue is.

If you can't take being harassed, don't go to see Stand-up.

What is it with New Zelanders thinking they have any idea what racism in America is like?
The reason you think that way is because you are white (most likely, unless you fall in that 14% indigenous peoples or 6% asian descent) you really wouldn't have to worry about being harrassed. Not only that, but even IF you were to be harrassed, none of the harrassment would strike a cord since you nor your people have ever been oppressed or had racism used against them.

Wasn't the whole reason Europeans moved to America because they were being persecuted because of their religion? Well the pilgrims anyway.

But cracker is racist terminology. Your logic is so stupid it's pathetic.

Religion =/= race, what is your point again?
What does cracker mean? What MAKES it racist?

The reason ****** is a hurtful word is because of the time period it went along with.
People don't get worked up over words that mean nothing.

I would say that you're logic is stupid, but you really don't have any.

New Zealand is similar in the way that we have a race breakdown close to yours.

The White people weren't here first. The native Maori of the country were persecuted etc etc etc.

I don't think I know everything about Racism in America. Not once did I say that. I just can't get over how over-analytical your society is.

It was a fucking joke. Get over it.

Did you watch the video? It wasn't a joke.
Harrassing audience members is not a joke and harrassing them because of their race certainly is not a joke.

It's called Heckling.

Google it.

It's real.

This is what RHYMEFESTkillah has basically said in this thread:

Only white people can be racist, because, ya know, they're white.
Black people can't be racist because, ya know, they're black.

In theory he's being racist right now, racial prejudice.

Pwned.

Argument over.

Close thread :)

Well done, Hiu.

What is it with you thinking we don't know what it's like?

Our "indiginous" people are mostly black and they follow the same idealisms of black americans. Their culture is huge in our country, we even split our national anthem into two versions.

Racism is not an America only thing, you're not any further up the road to understanding it then we are.



Woohoo thank you for saying this. What difference does singling out have as opposed to talking in general? It's still the same thing. There is no difference between what that black guy said on stage to a live audience than if he had said it specifically to someone. It's still labelling a group derogatorily. Again, these double standards are bull.

In the end words are words. If no actions were taken I can't see it being a bigger deal than realizing someone is ******* with poor character that you don't want to be affiliated with. I mean I know things can be hurtful but at some point you have to draw the line and say well **** there's nothing I can do about it, forget them. Sueing someone over words? Are you serious? That's bull****.

I know what it's called, and hecklers should be humiliated, but because of their race?

In America, at the moment, only white people can be racist, because, if you weren't so thick that you read MY country's definition of racism, as well as the definition pretty much universally accepted by scholars and sociologists, racism NEEDS power behind it to work. Prejudice doesn't, and blacks or whites or whoever else can be prejudiced, but not racist. That is reserved for whites at the moment.

What hiu has basically said in this thread:

"I'm a ****ing idiot"
*attempt at sarcasm/clever witty joke*

Pwned?
Maybe if that is what I had actually said and MAYBE if it wasn't true...but racism needs power to work. Whites = Power in America.

There is no difference at all, just there was no one who PERSONALLY felt humiliated enough to make a big deal about it.
Had he singled someone out, that person would have complained. Also, if it was some no-name comedian, why would it make news anyway?