Music Banter - The Serial Killer Thread

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The Serial Killer Thread

So like, as internet weirdos I'm sure we've all spent at least some time looking up serial killers, so here's a thread where we can just talk about whatever the **** we want to related to serial killers.

Note: Consider this a safe zone for people interested in psychopathic murderers, so if anyone wants to come in and complain about how Ted Bundy gets all the press whereas his victims are forgotten, then this is not the thread for you. There's a reason why serial killers get remembered and their victims do not: what killers do is notably interesting, unlike normal people who generally do nothing more of note than anyone else. Just saying.

I was recently watching a Stone Phillips interview with Jeffrey Dahmer and it struck me just how normal the dude sounded. I know that's kind of a cliche when talking about serial killers, but so many of them KINDA sound like normal people, but still have that thing about them that is not quite so normal. When talking about their crimes they often come across as bragging, or at least like they're reliving their crimes while all of us just happen to be watching. Or you have someone like Ted Bundy who comes across like a politician, saying exactly what he thinks you want to hear, but like he's on cocaine because he's so hyped up on the thought of you hearing about how awesome he is.

But Dahmer just seems like he has no interest in what he's done. Not so much like he's ashamed, but like he's answering questions and not trying to take control of the interview away from the interviewer just so he can grab as much attention as he possibly can.

For most of the interview he come across as legitimately normal in a way that most don't, in a way that I can actually see myself enjoying a conversation with him. He breaks the spell when he talks about how he's accepted Jesus as his savior (not criticising Christianity, just Jeffrey Dahmer's interpretation of it), and how he believes that morality is entirely derived from the edicts of God. It's clear from his religious views that he has no conscience, and cannot contemplate the conscience of those who do have one, so he can only understand the idea as a series of restrictive laws to keep people in line as if there was nothing innate within them keeping them from murdering, raping, and stealing everything not nailed down.

But yeah, other than that Dahmer comes across as normal in a way that is abnormal even for the serial killers I've seen in interviews. It's also highly, HIGHLY unusual just how honest, forthright, and disinterested in not making himself look like a victim he is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1709784)

What are you, LiL?

Yeah that was my first thought. This place is more apt for a Killer Cereal thread.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1709784)

What are you, LiL?

Quote:

Originally Posted by FRED HALE SR. (Post 1709785)

Yeah that was my first thought. This place is more apt for a Killer Cereal thread.

*boring people noted*

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord (Post 1709788)

*boring people noted*

Please tell us more about how long your hair is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1709797)

Please tell us more about how long your hair is.

What does that have to do with how badass sexual cannibalism is?

ever since first hearing about dahmer, i've been fascinated with him. not in a creepy way just in a why the **** did he do that way.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord (Post 1709798)

What does that have to do with how badass sexual cannibalism is?

I surely don't know, LiL.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1709800)

I surely don't know, LiL.

If you're not interested in this thread then why are you here? I made it clear that this is not a thread for people who don't want to talk about serial killers. This thread is amoral by nature.

i also remember watching the dahmer movie when i was like 13 cuz i was hoping there'd be some hot sex scenes

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord (Post 1709802)

If you're not interested in this thread then why are you here? I made it clear that this is not a thread for people who don't want to talk about serial killers. This thread is amoral by nature.

I'm here to make fun of you, obviously.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pansy gayboy 69 (Post 1709803)

i also remember watching the dahmer movie when i was like 13 cuz i was hoping there'd be some hot sex scenes

What movie was this?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1709805)

I'm here to make fun of you, obviously.

I'm pretty drunk so fish in a barrel.

dahmer is too mainstream

lets talk about abul djabar

Quote:

Killed 65 men and boys by strangling them with turbans while raping them. Suspected of over 300 murders. Djabar was arrested by police while trying to kill another victim. He was sentenced to death and hanged on 21 October 1970. Two innocent people had previously been executed for the murders.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord (Post 1709806)

What movie was this?

Dahmer (2002)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord (Post 1709806)

I'm pretty drunk so fish in a barrel.

Already am.

Harold Shipman.

250+ victims. I remember this at the time. He would inject his patients with lethal doses of whatever it was, alter medical records and put himself in patients' wills before murdering them. Got away with it for years, even got confronted by one family and then they thought they got it wrong and he continued killing.

There are a load of documentaries about him on Youtube, so give them a watch.

There's more, but I'll wait.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pansy gayboy 69 (Post 1709807)

dahmer is too mainstream

lets talk about abul djabar

Meh. The four highest number of kills were killers in South America, three of them in Brazil, because the authorities sucked at being authorities. In the USA our police know how to catch criminals so dudes who can kill up to thirty people like Bundy, Gacy, or the Green River Killer are more notable.

i didn't mean because he killed more people. its just you hear about dahmer so much... there are other interesting serial killers too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pansy gayboy 69 (Post 1709807)

dahmer is too mainstream

lets talk about abul djabar

Kinda hard to talk about the dude when the Afghanistan government seems to want to keep most of his life a secret.

Read this:

https://www.amazon.com/Stranger-Besi.../dp/1416559590

Quote:

Sometime during the evening of January 14 or the early hours of January 15, 1978—one week after his arrival in Tallahassee—Bundy entered FSU's Chi Omega sorority house through a rear door with a faulty lock. Beginning at about 2:45 am he bludgeoned Margaret Bowman, 21, with a piece of oak firewood as she slept, then garroted her with a nylon stocking. He then entered the bedroom of 20-year-old Lisa Levy and beat her unconscious, strangled her, tore one of her nipples, bit deeply into her left buttock, and sexually assaulted her with a hair mist bottle. In an adjoining bedroom he attacked Kathy Kleiner, breaking her jaw and deeply lacerating her shoulder; and Karen Chandler, who suffered a concussion, broken jaw, loss of teeth, and a crushed finger. Tallahassee detectives later determined that the four attacks took place in a total of less than 15 minutes, within earshot of more than 30 witnesses who heard nothing. After leaving the sorority house Bundy broke into a basement apartment eight blocks away and attacked FSU student Cheryl Thomas, dislocating her shoulder and fracturing her jaw and skull in five places. She was left with permanent deafness, and equilibrium damage that ended her dance career. On Thomas's bed police found a semen stain and a pantyhose "mask" containing two hairs "similar to Bundy's in class and characteristic".

http://img1.liveinternet.ru/images/a...9_0000f5t6.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord (Post 1709817)

Kinda hard to talk about the dude when the Afghanistan government seems to want to keep most of his life a secret.

oh yeah forgot about that. sitir. its a thing in islam. you're not supposed to 'expose' others. haram.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chula Vista (Post 1709826)

Read this:

https://www.amazon.com/Stranger-Besi.../dp/1416559590

http://img1.liveinternet.ru/images/a...9_0000f5t6.jpg

Already read it. Amazing book. Kinda makes you think about how many lives he may have saved while working at a suicide hotline. Like, did Ted Bundy actually preserve more lives than he took? Did he actually have more of a positive effect on the world than I have? Regardless of whether or not his motivation for working at a suicide hotline was for a feeling control over the lives that he saved, it's still trippy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pansy gayboy 69 (Post 1709828)

oh yeah forgot about that. sitir. its a thing in islam. you're not supposed to 'expose' others. haram.

So the Middle East sucks for serial killer stories?

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord (Post 1709838)

So the Middle East sucks for serial killer stories?

meh. it depends. not everyone cares about sitir.

Then gimme some good'uns.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord (Post 1709838)

Did he actually have more of a positive effect on the world than I have?

**** no. You don't fully comprehend just how important and life saving that whopper is to many when they just have to have one!

The employees at my local 24/7 Denny's have saved more lives that our hospital emergency room FFS.

The part of that book that was crazy was when Ann Rule finally came to grips with the fact that her close friend was indeed a horrific monster and had to go throw up in the courthouse bathroom because of the realization.

I really felt in her shoes during that part of the story.

some of my faves.

Quote:

Mahin Qadri is Iran’s first documented female serial killer. She was convicted for killing six people including five women between February 2008 and May 2009 in the city of Qazvin. Most of her victims were elderly women whom she picked up outside prayer houses. Once they entered her car, she played mind games with them, telling them how much they reminded her of her own mother. She then offered them drugged juice to knock them out, after which she suffocated them to death and robbed them. In one instance, a victim regained consciousness, and she finished her off with an iron rod. But when one of her would-be victims escaped and alerted the police, Mahin’s spree came to an end.Mahin claimed she committed the murders solely for the money, being £16,000 in debt. She also claimed to have taken tips from Agatha Christie novels, which are quite popular in Iran. Agatha Christie visited the country several times and even used it as the setting for one of her stories, “The House of Shiraz.”Mahin was sentenced to death and was hanged in a prison in Qazvin.

Quote:

Brothers George and Michel Tanielian killed 11 people, mostly taxi drivers, in Lebanon’s Metn district, earning themselves the nickname “The Taxi Driver Killers.” They boarded taxis at night, and George would sit in front beside the driver while Michel would sit at the back. Once they got to a remote location, George would tell the driver to pull over so that he could relieve himself. As soon as the driver pulled over and George began to exit the vehicle, Michel would shoot the driver in the head. They’d then rob the body and set the car on fire. Sometimes, they’d dump the body by the roadside and use the cab to carry other victims, whom they also robbed and killed. Lebanese intelligence officers once went undercover, posing as taxi drivers to catch the brothers. An agent once engaged them in a struggle, but they managed to escape. The pair were arrested after police tracked a victim’s phone that they’d sold. Along with the two of them, police arrested three other brothers as suspects, until Michel confessed during questioning that he and George had carried out the killings. George and Michel were charged before a military court and were sentenced to death.

Quote:

Saeed Hanaei’s murders were known as “The Spider Killings” because he wrapped the bodies like a spider. All of his victims were prostitutes whom he picked up from the streets of Mashad, Iran. He took them to his house, where he strangled them with their headscarves and wrapped their bodies with their chadors. He then dumped their bodies on the streets. Once the body was found, Saeed would return to the scene and even help police in carrying the corpse into an ambulance. Police found 19 bodies, and Saeed claimed responsibility for 16 of them, saying he’d have killed as many as 150 had he not been caught. He claimed to have started killing prostitutes after a driver mistook his wife for one. He described prostitutes as a “waste of blood,” as worthless to him as cockroaches.The killings won Saeed many fans who said he fought indecency and vice. His 14-year-old son even defended him in court, saying his father was “cleaning the Islamic Republic of the corrupt of the Earth, and many would replace him if he was killed.” The boy claimed 20 people had told him to continue his father’s work, but he’d told them, “Let’s wait and see.” One fact that Saeed’s supporters didn’t realize was that he actually had sex with most of the prostitutes before killing them. Saeed Hanaei was sentenced to death and was hanged on April 17, 2002.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chula Vista (Post 1709848)

I think it was when the book finally went into the nitty gritty of just how ****ed up his rituals were. When he's just bludgeoning women and strangling them with panty hose it's all funny games, but when he's keeping their severed heads in his house on a row on his bookshelf, or visiting their rotting corpses in the woods and ****ing them... then it gets a bit weird.

Marie Delphine Lalaurie

Quote:

The Lalauries maintained several black slaves in slave quarters attached to the Royal Street mansion. Accounts of Delphine Lalaurie's treatment of her slaves between 1831 and 1834 are mixed. Harriet Martineau, writing in 1838 and recounting tales told to her by New Orleans residents during her 1836 visit, claimed Lalaurie's slaves were observed to be "singularly haggard and wretched;" however, in public appearances Lalaurie was seen to be generally polite to black people and solicitous of her slaves' health, and court records of the time showed that Lalaurie manumitted two of her own slaves (Jean Louis in 1819 and Devince in 1832). Nevertheless, Martineau reported that public rumors about Lalaurie's mistreatment of her slaves were sufficiently widespread that a local lawyer was dispatched to Royal Street to remind LaLaurie of the laws relevant to the upkeep of slaves. During this visit, the lawyer found no evidence of wrongdoing or mistreatment of slaves by Lalaurie.

Martineau also recounted other tales of Lalaurie's cruelty that were current among New Orleans residents in about 1836. She claimed that, subsequent to the visit of the local lawyer, one of Lalaurie's neighbors saw one of the LaLaurie's slaves, a twelve-year-old girl named Lia (or Leah), fall to her death from the roof of the Royal Street mansion while trying to avoid punishment from a whip-wielding Delphine LaLaurie. Lia had been brushing Delphine's hair when she hit a snag, causing Delphine to grab a whip and chase her. The body was subsequently buried on the mansion grounds. According to Martineau, this incident led to an investigation of the Lalauries, in which they were found guilty of illegal cruelty and forced to forfeit nine slaves. These nine slaves were then bought back by the Lalauries through the intermediary of one of their relatives, and returned to the Royal Street residences. Similarly, Martineau reported stories that LaLaurie kept her cook chained to the kitchen stove, and beat her daughters when they attempted to feed the slaves.

On April 10, 1834, a fire broke out in the LaLaurie residence on Royal Street, starting in the kitchen. When the police and fire marshals got there, they found a seventy-year-old woman, the cook, chained to the stove by her ankle. She later confessed to them that she had set the fire as a suicide attempt for fear of her punishment, being taken to the uppermost room, because she said that anyone who was taken there never came back. As reported in the New Orleans Bee of April 11, 1834, bystanders responding to the fire attempted to enter the slave quarters to ensure that everyone had been evacuated. Upon being refused the keys by the Lalauries, the bystanders broke down the doors to the slave quarters and found "seven slaves, more or less horribly mutilated ... suspended by the neck, with their limbs apparently stretched and torn from one extremity to the other", who claimed to have been imprisoned there for some months.

One of those who entered the premises was Judge Jean-Francois Canonge, who subsequently deposed to having found in the LaLaurie mansion, among others, a "negress ... wearing an iron collar" and "an old negro woman who had received a very deep wound on her head [who was] too weak to be able to walk." Canonge claimed that when he questioned Madame Lalaurie's husband about the slaves, he was told in an insolent manner that "some people had better stay at home rather than come to others' houses to dictate laws and meddle with other people's business."

A version of this story circulating in 1836, recounted by Martineau, added that the slaves were emaciated, showed signs of being flayed with a whip, were bound in restrictive postures, and wore spiked iron collars which kept their heads in static positions.

When the discovery of the tortured slaves became widely known, a mob of local citizens attacked the Lalaurie residence and "demolished and destroyed everything upon which they could lay their hands". A sheriff and his officers were called upon to disperse the crowd, but by the time the mob left, the Royal Street property had sustained major damage, with "scarcely any thing [remaining] but the walls." The tortured slaves were taken to a local jail, where they were available for public viewing. The New Orleans Bee reported that by April 12 up to 4,000 people had attended to view the tortured slaves "to convince themselves of their sufferings."

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1709784)

What are you, LiL?

What does LiL mean?

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob. (Post 1710544)

What does LiL mean?

LadyisLingering

Here's my thoughts on serial killers in general, prepare for tl'dr.

Serial killers, to me, are fascinating. And before you judge me by saying "oh man, you like people that kill people?" No, that is not the case. I'm human and I know right from wrong, and I understand the stigma around people that are fascinated by this type of thing. It's very easy for someone to go up to someone when they express in an interest in this type of thing and say "man, you're ****ed up." I don't find people that are interested in this type of thing to be anywhere near as ****ed up as people claim that they are, because to me, being interested in serial killers is the same as being interested in murder mysteries, or horror games, and the like. There's something about it that sparks an interest in some people, and for other people to tell them they're ****ed up in the head is a weak mans argument.

To me, a serial killer is interesting for one thing and one thing only: their brain. When I first heard about what a serial killer is, I did my research and found people in the past that have committed these crimes such as Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy, and Richard Ramirez to name a few. There's countless others, but those three are the ones I did extensive research on. You have to wonder what kind of brain chemistry these people had when they committed these crimes. A normal person wouldn't just go out one day and think "man, i'm going to kill people today." No, it seems like it's much deeper than that. A lot of serial killers, even today, have had some common trends that made them this way. Some of them had a really bad upbringing, and I mean really bad. When it comes to the way the brain works, there's never been any certainty especially with how quickly people can be manipulated into thinking something is right, and vice versa. I've always wondered and I still wonder about how the serial killers think when they progress from victim to victim. Normal people obviously feel remorse even for the smallest things, like when a cat dies, or a parent dies, but something about the brains of the individuals that commit these crimes have been said to not feel any remorse, some of them have found enjoyment and pleasure out of it, i.e. rapists, necrophiliacs, etc. There are also countless pictures whether they're in court, or even documentaries of such individuals where their facial expression doesn't change, even when they speak about the people they have killed. A good example of this is the interview with Ted Bundy before he was executed.

If you watch his face as the interview progresses, he doesn't seem fazed by his acts at all. He's able to speak openly about his crimes and smile as he does so. He also states that he feels calm even though he is so close to his execution. He again states that his home life was fantastic and never dealt with any sexual or physical abuse.

When I watch interviews about these killers, there's also a common trend that the killer is able to speak about the crimes openly and not feel any remorse. You have to wonder as they are speaking openly about their crimes what seems to be going through their heads. Is there something that the brain is telling them to say? Or do they really feel that what they did isn't considered a bad thing? The obvious answer for normal people would be that it is of course a bad thing, but when you look at the killers in their interviews, you can't help but wonder what's going through their head.

One more thing I would like to mention is the fact that I strongly believe, and have believed this for some time, that serial killers are actually (and most of them are) considered geniuses. I know I mentioned before that they seem to lose control of their mind and get twisted into thinking whats right and wrong, but it has to take some sort of intelligence be it about how humans work or how the brain works, to allow yourself to be manipulated to the point of feeling no remorse for killing people. A lot of killers have had a history of going to college and being successful and had they not been manipulated mentally, they could have been something great. For me, if there was ever an opportunity to look into a killer brain and just see what they're thinking, it would be a fascinating experience. Hell, would it be scary? Of course it would, but ever since I discovered the process of serial killers and the way they think and how they came to be, I've been more and more interested in how the brain functions. Like I said, there's never really been a direct answer as to how this stuff works, but even in the interview I posted above, I don't think i'd be scared giving the interview at all. Instead, I'd actually be excited to be sitting down and being able to tap into the mind of someone that is obviously mentally ill, in some way.

I do also often wonder how one could have stopped a serial killer from committing the acts that he did, and whether that person would have been successful. This also brings to light how one thing that either goes right or goes wrong could change someone's life forever. It's like from Back to the Future when they go back in time, and it's stated that one small change could change the future forever. I feel like this in some way related. Imagine if any of the killers would have met one specific person, or had changed their direction on the street, like going left instead of right. It could have been a difference of whether they decide to go on a murderous rampage or not. Then again, some killers did have a fantastic upbringing and a good life, so I suppose in that case it wouldn't make sense. But just imagine if one person made a difference in their life, it could have changed them forever. Granted, that is how some killers came to be killers in the first place.

At the end of the day, being interested in serial killers becomes the easiest thing to judge about people, and it's not fair. It sparks an interest, and yes, they are interesting. Some may say that it can create comfort in reading about these people. I find it to be the same as if I were researching a past president, or someone who died in war, it's all the same to me. I've never once considered anybody who finds interest in serial killers to be bad people. Hell, most of them are super cool and fun to talk to because they don't get offended so easily.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ki (Post 1710603)

One more thing I would like to mention is the fact that I strongly believe, and have believed this for some time, that serial killers are actually (and most of them are) considered geniuses.

Have to disagree with this. Gary Ridgeway, Jefferey Dahmer, Otis Toole, Fritz Harrman, Aileen Wuoros, Charles Ng, Richard Ramirez, and most others I've read about were troubled kids with below average IQs and/or learning disorders.

Ted Bundy is a rare exception.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chula Vista (Post 1710613)

True.

To me the fascination with serial killers is that they are the ultimate example of the dark underside of the human race. We have such a sanitized culture of Facebook, late night talk shows, Christmas dinner, overpriced clothes designed to make us fit in, politicians with their double speak, and just a general whitewashing of the more brutal side of reality.

But serial killers are something that are totally at odds with white picket fences and pop culture. They're a blemish on our society that forces us to admit that Kim Kardashian is totally innocuous, no matter how much we might demonize her as the worst thing to ever happen to our culture. Serial killers are real in a way that is ignored by our day-to-day lives.

It's the same reason we're so fascinated with the Nazis, or watching footage from conflicts in the Middle East. It's why half of our shows are police procedurals or somehow involve crime.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chula Vista (Post 1710613)

Huh? Ted Bundy had a 136 iq which while above average is not genius level. Dahmer was a 145. Charlene Williams had the highest iq of any serial killer in history with a 160. Loeb and Leopold had 150 and 158 iq's. Carrol Cole had a 152. Andrew Cunanan surprisingly had a 147 iq. There are many more that fall in the genius level but i'm not gonna look anymore up. Ted Bundy is the exception to being genius maybe because he wasn't.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FRED HALE SR. (Post 1710648)

Anything above 130 is considered extremely gifted. But after researching this more you're right. There's lots of very intelligent serial killers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chula Vista (Post 1710667)

Anything above 130 is considered extremely gifted. But after researching this more you're right. There's lots of very intelligent serial killers.

Genius level is 140 and up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chula Vista (Post 1710697)

I found it odd that Dahmer had a higher iq then Bundy myself. Bundy always came across as so polished and engaging in interviews i suspected he was genius level also.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FRED HALE SR. (Post 1710699)

I found it odd that Dahmer had a higher iq then Bundy myself. Bundy always came across as so polished and engaging in interviews i suspected he was genius level also.

He was much more charismatic (at least on TV) than Dahmer, so it makes him look smarter. I imagine there are plenty of used car salesmen who can make you think they're much smarter than they really are.