Lady Gaga

~~Sansa Stark~~ · 09-11-2010, 09:33 AM

Yeah but getting snotty and being rude in an argument doesn't really help your case.

ImmortalDiotima · 09-14-2010, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paloma

Yeah but getting snotty and being rude in an argument doesn't really help your case.

If you can show me an example where I've been snotty and rude (most likely an example from my very first post which I apologized for) I can show you 10 more examples where I have been perfectly respectful whilst maintaining my opinion against an onslaught of people trying to tell me that my opinion is wrong. I have maintained respect of the opinions of others while many have attacked me simply because my opinion of their beloved gaga is negative. Do not accuse me of rudeness. I have been quite polite.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AwwSugar

Somebody made a really good point about Gaga.
That she doesn't need people to like her, she just wants people to talk about her.
Which is what everyone is doing.
What do you guys think about this?

I'm pretty sure the quote you're talking about was actually about me. She was saying that even if people don't agree with me, at least I'm moving the conversation along...
IF you're quoting the quote I think you're quoting

Quote:

Originally Posted by VEGANGELICA

This isn't a comment against you, Consolator; I'm just musing out loud about the topic of Lady Gaga seeming cold to some people:

I wonder if people sometimes expect a female performer to be more vulnerable than a male performer, and hold it against her if she *doesn't* seem vulnerable. I've never heard anyone say of a male performer, "Oh, he doesn't tear up! He must not be in touch with his emotions. He is cold," and disliking him for that.

Yes, I agree with what you say, マイケル : Lady Gaga's ostentatious emphasis on *things* (clothing, etc.) rather than mainly on the music alone may make us face something we don't like about our culture: its shallow consumerism.

That being said, one of my favorite songs and videos was always Madonna's Material Girl, and I didn't mind its shallow consumerism message at all, though I assume the song was meant to be ironic rather than an endorsement of materialism. I wonder to what extent Lady Gaga's outfits and personas are intended in the same way. Or maybe she is just having fun thinking up and appreciating new and odd things!

I agree, AwwSugar: I think she doesn't need people to like her. I don't think she is concerned so much if she appears sexy, for example. I feel a lot of her clothing isn't intended to be sexual so much as provocative and startling. I assume she *does* want people to like her music, though.

And I think of course she wants people to talk about her; this increases interest in her music, her shows.

This is EXACTLY what I've been talking about. The main revulsion is the revulsion with how materialistic our society is. The reason I say I don't like Gaga is that she has found herself in a position of the utmost power and chooses, instead of challenging materialism, to PERPETUATE it to the utmost degree. So yes, my initial complaint is with the society itself. But if you have millions of screaming, insecure teenagers ready to wear a lady gaga mask every day for the rest of their lives (or at least until something "cooler" comes along) you should (if you want to be in my good book, which you don't have to be, lady gaga) take responsibility and send the right message to these people that clothes have nothing to do with who you are. You should make good music and inspire others to express themselves through music (or other art forms) instead of using catchy music as a catalyst to promote your image.

And I agree with many points of that article you posted Goblintears... except i don't know why he/she feels the need to attack the way Gaga looks, or her body. That's unnecessary.

nylonsmile · 09-15-2010, 01:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImmortalDiotima

This is EXACTLY what I've been talking about. The main revulsion is the revulsion with how materialistic our society is. The reason I say I don't like Gaga is that she has found herself in a position of the utmost power and chooses, instead of challenging materialism, to PERPETUATE it to the utmost degree. So yes, my initial complaint is with the society itself. But if you have millions of screaming, insecure teenagers ready to wear a lady gaga mask every day for the rest of their lives (or at least until something "cooler" comes along) you should (if you want to be in my good book, which you don't have to be, lady gaga) take responsibility and send the right message to these people that clothes have nothing to do with who you are. You should make good music and inspire others to express themselves through music (or other art forms) instead of using catchy music as a catalyst to promote your image.

.......Lady Gaga is hardly concerned with whether people go out and buy the fancy car or clothes she mentions in her songs. If anything, a central theme in the Fame was clearly celebrity for all. She's even discussed it herself in interviews. She wanted someone to be able to listen to her songs and feel like a sort of celebrity. To blame her for 'perpetuating materialism to its utmost degree' is so dramatic and misses the point. She's hardly more responsible than many other mainstream celebrities who endorse products out the ying-yang.

VEGANGELICA · 09-15-2010, 05:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kayleigh.

Vege, your last paragraph made me lol. I imagine you having kittens right now at the thought of a meat purse

Several!

They are very cute.

Anyhoo, here's the article about GaGa's meat purse, and it says she didn't mean disrespect to vegetarians or vegans by it (!), and:

Quote:

Lady Gaga explained later that the fleshy look -- which she repeats with a meat swimming suit on the October cover of Vogue Hommes in Japan -- 'has many interpretations.' She said, "If we don't stand up for what we believe in and if we don't fight for our rights, pretty soon we're going to have as much rights as the meat on our own bones. And I am not a piece of meat."

The most common theory is that her steak-powered statement referenced her support for gays in the US military and opposition to the 'don't ask, don't tell' policy on homosexuals in the ranks.AFP: Critics skewer Lady Gaga's meat dress.

So, in deference to Urban Hatemonger's earlier criticism of GaGa's artistic statements as being unclear, I must say that I would have to agree with him about this one: I had no clue that the meat outfit might be a statement for gay rights. So, Urban, you are right! And I was wrong.

Now, maybe if she'd dangled the penises and vaginas of slaughtered cows and steers all over her, the point would have been clearer (if gay rights *was* her point). That's what *I* would have done if I wanted to use meat to symbolize how people should not be discriminated against based on their genitalia. If I weren't vegan, of course. I suppose I could have still used genitalia donated from deceased fans... :/

Quote:

Originally Posted by マイケル

As a sort of interesting aside, I never really thought much of Madonna's song "Material Girl". It always struck me as a rather witless reiteration of Marilyn Monroe's "Diamonds Are A Girl's Best Friend".

Sacrilege!!! No love for "Material Girl?!" I'd say it is a cut above "Diamonds Are A Girl's Best Friend," which I think was not meant tongue-in-cheek. Since you don't like the song by GaGa's predecessor, you might like this cover of it: YouTube - Madonna - Material Girl (Exhumed cover)

Quote:

Originally Posted by nylonsmile

If anything, a central theme in the Fame was clearly celebrity for all. She's even discussed it herself in interviews. To blame her for 'perpetuating materialism to its utmost degree' is so dramatic and misses the point. She's hardly more responsible than many other mainstream celebrities who endorse products out the ying-yang.

Agreed! And does Lady Gaga actually endorse any products out the ying-yang?

マイケル · 09-16-2010, 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vegangelica

sacrilege!!!

lol

Goblin Tears · 09-16-2010, 10:12 AM

Quote:

"Well, it is certainly no disrespect to anyone that is vegan or vegetarian. As you know, I am the most judgment-free human being on the earth," Gaga replied.

Most judgement free on Earth? That's quite a claim. And also, apparently nobody loves her fans as much as she does. There is no limit to her God like powers of non-judgement and compassion.

View Poll Results: Best Gaga Album...?!?!
The Fame	5	41.67%
The Fame Monster	3	25.00%
Born This Way	4	33.33%
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09-11-2010, 09:33 AM	#1 (permalink)
~~Sansa Stark~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: The Eyrie, Vale of Arryn, Westeros Posts: 3,234	Yeah but getting snotty and being rude in an argument doesn't really help your case.