POP/PUNK is dead

Holerbot6000 · 08-02-2012, 02:09 AM

Crossover Thrash? Deathcore? Who comes up with this sh*t? Sorry, I'm old and I'm running out of time so I can't be bothered to worry whether the punk rock I'm listening to is Speed Flap or Post Garbage Can. I just want to jump around and ROK out.

I do remember back in those 'Punk as Movement' days when some kids would get really snotty about what was and wasn't punk. Black Flag was hilariously notorious for playing sets of heavy metal and psychedelic covers whenever they faced an elitist punk crowd.

I understand what you're saying about being part of something, where maybe a particular type of music transcends a moment in time and becomes something more than the sum of it's parts, but I don't think that phenomenon is unique to punk rock. And I don't think it's fair to kill Punk off as a legitimate genre just because that moment has passed.

Punk is Punk, no matter how many dizzying sub genres you want to divide it up into and, as such, I think it's alive and well and always will be. Just one more crayon in the musical box, as it were.

bob. · 08-02-2012, 06:43 AM

first and foremost...joy circumcision did not add a single word to your mouth....all he added was a couple of genres that would obviously be added to you weird genre breakdown list

second thumbs up to Holerbot6000

before i go off on your points...i have a question....what is the punk movement?

the "punk is dead" bullshit started nanoseconds after the where did punk come from argument started

but i would love to read what your idea of the punk movement is before i state my case

in closure

this is a band called 7 Seconds...they were from the shitiest redneck, backwoods town in Nevada....Reno

this song was first released on a comp in 1984 by BYO records....and basically sums up my argument

but please enlighten me as to what the punk movement was and why it is dead

~~MrMagic1234~~ · 08-02-2012, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Holerbot6000

Crossover Thrash? Deathcore? Who comes up with this sh*t? Sorry, I'm old and I'm running out of time so I can't be bothered to worry whether the punk rock I'm listening to is Speed Flap or Post Garbage Can. I just want to jump around and ROK out.

I do remember back in those 'Punk as Movement' days when some kids would get really snotty about what was and wasn't punk. Black Flag was hilariously notorious for playing sets of heavy metal and psychedelic covers whenever they faced an elitist punk crowd.

I understand what you're saying about being part of something, where maybe a particular type of music transcends a moment in time and becomes something more than the sum of it's parts, but I don't think that phenomenon is unique to punk rock. And I don't think it's fair to kill Punk off as a legitimate genre just because that moment has passed.

Punk is Punk, no matter how many dizzying sub genres you want to divide it up into and, as such, I think it's alive and well and always will be. Just one more crayon in the musical box, as it were.

Actually Black Flag's my favorite band and I dig a lot of stuff other then punk so it's not like I'm a snotty elitist about it. It's perfectly fair to kill punk off. It's dead. Its spirit EXISTS in the dizzying subgenres, but a father and mother's spirit exists within their child, that doesn't mean the child is a carbon copy of their mother and father. I'm a eighth Native American, the blood and spirit of my great grandfather is within me, but that doesn't mean I could start a tribe with a bunch of other white people with a slight bit of Native American in them. I COULD but how the hell could we possibly say we're a Native American tribe when we're all related to people who slaughtered Native Americans as well?

Same thing with punk and the subgenres.

Also, your statement about Black Flag is a bit spun. They didn't play psychedelia and metal specifically to piss off punk elitists, they played it because that's what they began to enjoy playing and it pissed off the punk elitists who were their fans and after awhile they obviously begun to get a kick out of it.

~~MrMagic1234~~ · 08-02-2012, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob.

first and foremost...joy circumcision did not add a single word to your mouth....all he added was a couple of genres that would obviously be added to you weird genre breakdown list

second thumbs up to Holerbot6000

before i go off on your points...i have a question....what is the punk movement?

the "punk is dead" bullshit started nanoseconds after the where did punk come from argument started

but i would love to read what your idea of the punk movement is before i state my case

in closure

this is a band called 7 Seconds...they were from the shitiest redneck, backwoods town in Nevada....Reno

this song was first released on a comp in 1984 by BYO records....and basically sums up my argument

but please enlighten me as to what the punk movement was and why it is dead

Using a song to express your opinion about something? This isn't Facebook bro.

Also, I already stated in my OP what the punk movement was and why it's dead. Did you only read the title of this thread?

You're seeming a bit ignorant here mate

**Janszoon** · 08-02-2012, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrMagic1234

Using a song to express your opinion about something? This isn't Facebook bro.

Guy who joined 2 days ago trying to tell guy who's been here for over 2 years what's what on MB: priceless.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrMagic1234

Also, I already stated in my OP what the punk movement was and why it's dead. Did you only read the title of this thread?

Actually you didn't explain what the "movement" was, all you did was say that it was a movement. Did you not read your own OP bro?

~~MrMagic1234~~ · 08-02-2012, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon

Guy who joined 2 days ago trying to tell guy who's been here for over 2 years what's what on MB: priceless.

Actually you didn't explain what the "movement" was, all you did was say that it was a movement. Did you not read your own OP bro?

Your Charlie Brown picture is stupid
Also I've been here seven years

**Janszoon** · 08-02-2012, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrMagic1234

Your Charlie Brown picture is stupid
Also I've been here seven years

Are you saying you have multiple accounts here then, bro?

joy_circumcision · 08-02-2012, 11:13 AM

This is the OP's argument as I interpret it:

"I have an arbitrary definition of punk rock as a movement and I put its arbitrary ending date at the end of the eighties because that's when the hardcore movement died, which is the last leg of punk rock according to my arbitrary definition of what it was as a movement - a definition I refuse to present for critical analysis. Now explain to me why I am right under my own definition."

"But OP, there are competing definitions for what the punk movement is. For example, I would say..."

"NOPE. Discuss as I stated in my OP IS punk, not this false "spirit of punk." Punk be dead!!"

OP, it's difficult to take you or your topic seriously when you make up these non-falsifiable definitions and have no elasticity of opinion, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say that there was some miscommunication on someone's part, so just provide for everyone a couple things to debate over:

1. What is your definition of punk rock music as a movement? Include sonic influences, cultural values, etc. Why is your definition better than everyone else's?

2. If your definition is superior, then extend it into other major umbrella genres such as prog, metal, and psychedelic rock - are these movements in any way dead because they have their own offshot descendents in the form of subgenres?

3. What does it really matter if punk is dead or not?

~~MrMagic1234~~ · 08-02-2012, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joy_circumcision

This is the OP's argument as I interpret it:

"I have an arbitrary definition of punk rock as a movement and I put its arbitrary ending date at the end of the eighties because that's when the hardcore movement died, which is the last leg of punk rock according to my arbitrary definition of what it was as a movement - a definition I refuse to present for critical analysis. Now explain to me why I am right under my own definition."

"But OP, there are competing definitions for what the punk movement is. For example, I would say..."

"NOPE. Discuss as I stated in my OP IS punk, not this false "spirit of punk." Punk be dead!!"

OP, it's difficult to take you or your topic seriously when you make up these non-falsifiable definitions and have no elasticity of opinion, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say that there was some miscommunication on someone's part, so just provide for everyone a couple things to debate over:

1. What is your definition of punk rock music as a movement? Include sonic influences, cultural values, etc. Why is your definition better than everyone else's?

2. If your definition is superior, then extend it into other major umbrella genres such as prog, metal, and psychedelic rock - are these movements in any way dead because they have their own offshot descendents in the form of subgenres?

3. What does it really matter if punk is dead or not?

No it's okay. I'll just **** off back to where I came from. You obviously all hate me and my ideas are retarded so nevermind. Sorry I wasted everyone's time

bob. · 08-02-2012, 02:07 PM

^awesome...so i don't have to write my winded argument about underground music and how you should get off you ass and go look for it rather than sit around an internet forum and bitch about how Black Flag was the end all of punk rock.....

08-02-2012, 06:43 AM	#52 (permalink)
bob. Still sends his reguards. Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Trying to get out of the cat town.... Posts: 5,039	first and foremost...joy circumcision did not add a single word to your mouth....all he added was a couple of genres that would obviously be added to you weird genre breakdown list second thumbs up to Holerbot6000 before i go off on your points...i have a question....what is the punk movement? the "punk is dead" bullshit started nanoseconds after the where did punk come from argument started but i would love to read what your idea of the punk movement is before i state my case in closure this is a band called 7 Seconds...they were from the shitiest redneck, backwoods town in Nevada....Reno this song was first released on a comp in 1984 by BYO records....and basically sums up my argument but please enlighten me as to what the punk movement was and why it is dead __________________ A kiss is the beginning of cannibalism. Reach out, pierce the fine fabric of the sheltering sky, take repose.

08-02-2012, 11:13 AM	#58 (permalink)
joy_circumcision Music Addict Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: New Orleans, LA Posts: 126	This is the OP's argument as I interpret it: "I have an arbitrary definition of punk rock as a movement and I put its arbitrary ending date at the end of the eighties because that's when the hardcore movement died, which is the last leg of punk rock according to my arbitrary definition of what it was as a movement - a definition I refuse to present for critical analysis. Now explain to me why I am right under my own definition." "But OP, there are competing definitions for what the punk movement is. For example, I would say..." "NOPE. Discuss as I stated in my OP IS punk, not this false "spirit of punk." Punk be dead!!" OP, it's difficult to take you or your topic seriously when you make up these non-falsifiable definitions and have no elasticity of opinion, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say that there was some miscommunication on someone's part, so just provide for everyone a couple things to debate over: 1. What is your definition of punk rock music as a movement? Include sonic influences, cultural values, etc. Why is your definition better than everyone else's? 2. If your definition is superior, then extend it into other major umbrella genres such as prog, metal, and psychedelic rock - are these movements in any way dead because they have their own offshot descendents in the form of subgenres? 3. What does it really matter if punk is dead or not? __________________ My Music Journal My RYM (My Pride and Joy)

08-02-2012, 02:07 PM	#60 (permalink)
bob. Still sends his reguards. Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Trying to get out of the cat town.... Posts: 5,039	^awesome...so i don't have to write my winded argument about underground music and how you should get off you ass and go look for it rather than sit around an internet forum and bitch about how Black Flag was the end all of punk rock..... __________________ A kiss is the beginning of cannibalism. Reach out, pierce the fine fabric of the sheltering sky, take repose.

08-02-2012, 02:09 AM	#51 (permalink)
Holerbot6000 Music Mutant Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: near a record store Posts: 327	Crossover Thrash? Deathcore? Who comes up with this sh*t? Sorry, I'm old and I'm running out of time so I can't be bothered to worry whether the punk rock I'm listening to is Speed Flap or Post Garbage Can. I just want to jump around and ROK out. I do remember back in those 'Punk as Movement' days when some kids would get really snotty about what was and wasn't punk. Black Flag was hilariously notorious for playing sets of heavy metal and psychedelic covers whenever they faced an elitist punk crowd. I understand what you're saying about being part of something, where maybe a particular type of music transcends a moment in time and becomes something more than the sum of it's parts, but I don't think that phenomenon is unique to punk rock. And I don't think it's fair to kill Punk off as a legitimate genre just because that moment has passed. Punk is Punk, no matter how many dizzying sub genres you want to divide it up into and, as such, I think it's alive and well and always will be. Just one more crayon in the musical box, as it were.