Punk was Invented in the USA
 

I have gotten into so many arguements with people about this and I don't understand why. It's like if you don't believe punk was invented in the UK when there's obvious reasons this is wrong you are comitting a sin.The Stooges, The Velvet Underground, Mc5, Death(not the the death metal band), New York Dolls, The Kingsmen and The Trashmen are all from the USA. Stooges and Mc5 had direct influences on UK bands. The Ramones were together before either The Sex Pistols or the Clash. US punk bands began forming in 74, UK bands didn't start til 76. I'm not even a patriotic person, I could give a **** about the USA, but I can't take that people won't admit punk didn't start in England.

Get into many debates with middle schoolers then?

You say Lady Gaga I say The Clash
You say Katy Perry I say The Ramones
You say Black Eyed Peas I say Sex Pistols
You say drop the bass I say drop Skrillex on his head!!!
97% of teens have gone to HIP HOP and POP Like this if your part of the 3% with TASTE

Also sorry but the political messages of the punk movement and not just the sonic/attitude influences did in fact come predominately from the UK sect. Their influence was sort of the catalyst for punk to come and though its quality is debatable you can't really overstate the singular nature of Never Mind the Bollocks in igniting the flame under dozens of young bands.

"Also sorry but the political messages of the punk movement and not just the sonic/attitude influences did in fact come predominately from the UK sect. Their influence was sort of the catalyst for punk to come and though its quality is debatable you can't really overstate the singular nature of Never Mind the Bollocks in igniting the flame under dozens of young bands."

Okay so what? Never Mind the Bollocks would have never happened without the bands I just mentioned having come along in the states. The content of punk has nothing to do with who founded it. So maybe UK bands were the first to have a lot of (overbearing if you ask me) political tones in there version of punk. Does that disprove what I just said about USA actually beginning the punk movement? Nope

pretty much

Punk wasn't invented it evolved and it didn't come into being as *punk* until the Sex pistols came along.

Whatever came before it or influenced it means sod all, Lydon was influenced by Hawkwind & Van Der Graff Generator. shall we call those proto punk bands too?

You're just retro-actively applying a label to when it didn't exist.

Actually, I believe the word was used before that to describe some of the CBGB bands, but you're right that no one in particular invented it. It was something that was bubbling up on both sides of the Atlantic at the same time. And considering how much the US and UK music scenes both influence each other, the evolution of punk was clearly a joint effort.

Just because the word "punk" didn't exist until a certain point doesn't mean that "punk" music didnt exist before it, It was just called something else.

The same principle can be applied to anything.

Well if that's the case, you can then apply that to nearly every musical genre out there and we'd be in an even bigger muddle than were already are. Punk started in 1976 and 1977 with the Ramones and the Sex Pistols etc, for the simple reason that all the aspects and characteristics that are associated with it, all came together at this time.

I'd go as far to say that The Who were pretty "punk" way before punk was popular, even back when they started. It was just called Mod then. A lot of bands that blew up on the punk scene in the mid to late 70's were influenced by The Who and their contemporaries. Maybe more UK bands (like the Jam), but probably some US bands as well.

As I see it, The Ramones, and (later) the Pistols, were among the first bands to be referred to as Punk rock groups. As already stated, the band with Johnny Ramone was aroiund a few years before the Johnny Rotten group.

Both Ramones and Pistols were influenced by other bands that more or less fit the mold of Punk rock music, but their precursors were not (and are still not) specifically called Punk rock groups.

It doesn't matter - let the sub-par bands fight it out too see whether it came from England or the US - because the best band came from Scotland.

"I always thought a punk was someone who took it up the ass."—William S. Burroughs

that is exactly what a punk is.....actually i seem to remember a documentary about CBGB's where an editor of "punk" magazine was in jail in upstate new york and was freaking out about the other prisoners finding out that he was involved in a mag called "punk"

so seriously

is it just me that really does not understand why people think The Velvet Underground have anything to do with punk rock?

i mean i love VU...and i love punk music (of all types....or at least most)...but i do not see the connection....not at least style wise

i'm so bored with the U.S.A.

Maybe because VU were credited with inspiring lots of people to start bands of their own and I think this gets mixed up with the garage band craze of the 1960's, which was going full force a few years before VU existed, and which definitely had a huge influence on the punk ethos.

If I had to pick a Grand daddy of Punk bands from that particular era, I would go with the Monks and Black Monk Time. That was a band/abum that really did inspire a lot of garage bands to get started and I think the Punk attitude is very prevalent in that music.

I'm not claiming this is where punk started, just that this was a very important chapter in the overall evolution of punk and well worth investigating for interested individuals. Beware though. 60's garage rock is very greasy and highly addictive!!! :bowdown:

How many times do we have to endure this sad old claim?
Give the baby it's dummy and close this thread!

One hundred fifty-eight. We're almost there.

I say forget the debate.

Now for a little Music Writer History...

The words Punk Rock were used by Lenny Kaye for the sleeve notes of the original Nuggets collection back in 1972, a collection of the classic Garage Punk of the 60's, released on Elektra.

Critic Dave Marsh also used it in 1971 in a Creem Magazine article (I think Lester Bangs used it too).

Long before the Pistols, and a little before The Ramones entered the studio and The Stooges unleashed some RAW POWER.

Outside of the well-known prison term, Punk meant in the straight world "worthless to society," "rebellious to authority," "loud and annoying," and, yes, "outside of society."

The sounds of the angry youth of The Late 60's and Early 70's seen as outsiders and anti-establishment around the world set the stage for what is known as Punk.
Back when it was Rock and Roll with extra attitude.

Yeah, the Politics were important by the Late 70's, although you could say that The MC5 built part of the base back through '68-70, but it was the aggression and power that helped make the message effective.
US Garage Punk and The UK Mod scenes go together for the start of it all.

Forget this US/UK debate. It's overused and NEVER gets anywhere.
Punk: It's the voice of angry people around the world. Forget who was first and enjoy.

Charlie Parker took a crap back in 1946 and said man thats punk rock. True story.

why do i feel that this is somehow going to end up being about John Lennon's infamous fart?

Because it pre-dates punk rock and inspires everything in its path?

but it could not end rocks biggest argument....

Was Peter Frampton better then Leif Garrett? I still wonder to this day.

ohhhh

damn man

this is a good question

i think i will need to meditate on this

i mean Peter could make his guitar talk

but Leif did a cover of Nirvana with Melvins

So in retrospect was it Leif Garrett that created punk rock? He did drive off a cliff, thats pretty damn punk rock.

driving off a cliff is hella punk rock dude

hella

so i guess it is true....punk started in the USA by Leif Garrett who later resurrected the grunge movement by joining with stoner/doom pioneers Melvins to resurrect the spirit of Kurt Cobain bringing peace and harmony back to the earth

ALL HAIL LEIF GARRETT!

IT WAS A BELCH!

Jesus, did we not clear this up...?

Or was it more of a burp?

Can i quote this in my punk rock blog? I think your like the next stephen hawking and **** dude. I think its a revelation.

ironically i am writing a book called "The Brief PUNK! History of Time"

in which time is a dirty, spiked hair, cider drinking leader of a crust band from Bristol UK

Sounds awesome. I bet time dies in a blackhole called grunge.

i'm basically gonna flip a coin on grunge/sunset strip hair metal

it's a tough choice

That would be solid gold having Bret Michaels be the end of the Crust era.

it is all coming together....

with the help of the band Ratt...Brett collects all the grimy gutter crust punks and by using the infamous "Ludovico" technique he forces them to watch clips from old exploited and crass videos whilst "every rose has it's thorns" gets implanted in their brains

You had me at RATT.

perfect song for the round up of punks

That polka dot armed shirt screams Discharge.

that's probably how they lured the punks there....a kind of "i like spikes and he likes spikes....we must be one in the same"

so to sum things up

Punk Rock was created in the USA by Leif Garrett when he drove his car off a cliff

Punk was then kidnapped and eventually brainwashed by Ratt and Bret Micheals utilizing the infamous "Ludovico" technique

after years of living in solitude on a mountain...the supreme GODHEAD Keith Partridge (in the body of David Cassidy) came down from the mountain and declared

"Punk Is Dead. And We Have Killed It."

Too bad The Exploited suck

US Punk>UK Punk
UK Metal>US Metal

That is the rule of all the universe

And distributed Puka shell necklaces to all the faithful. And it was good. Amen.