Guitarist for Sonic Youth.

You're the one who wants to argue. Nobody forcing you to be here on my thread.

This proves that your knowledge of what happened here in Seattle in the late '80's/early '90's is an inch deep. He's very important in the Seattle rock scene from that era.

Cobain did what he did. No he wasn't the most proficient guitarist in this town but he was a quality songwriter. Bleach was a great album. I never need to listen to Nevermind again.

So, that also raises the other side of the question. If, as you say and for the question of argument, Cobain was a poor guitarist, does that mean Jerry Cantrell can't play? Kim Thayil?

But more to the point, does it always have to be about proficiency? Neil Young is technically a very weak guitarist but made some very great music IMO. Yngwie Malmsteen could play standing on his head but I'd rather put a coarse wire brush bit in a high speed drill and torque out my ears than listen to a minute of his horrid music.

And Seattle wasn't all about grunge in those days, that's what David Geffin and Rolling Stone and those clowns turned it in to. Forced Entry headlined all the clubs here playing some of the greatest thrash the genre has ever known, all the big names were in awe of those guys, but they never made it out of Seattle. Same with My Sister's Machine.

And finally

Yeah, Hair Metal. I'm really really sorry you never got to hear Open Up and say "Ahh!" part 2. I'm sure everyone else mourns Warrant and Cinderella and Firehouse and Britny Fox as much as you do, but maybe it was just time to move on, ya think?

You're entitled to your opinion, but maybe you might consider that everyone else is too.

When did I claim to be an authority on the Seattle scene? I know nothing of Seattle. Never been there. I just don't like the music. And if I was an authority on Seattle, I still wouldn't like the music. If you don't like something, you don't like it. It's a visceral reaction you have no control over.

I'm sure he did write a good song or two but I thought he was terribly overrated. If it hadn't been for MTV, no one would have cared about Nirvana.

I don't know who they are so I can't comment. I like Grag Gihn (Black Flag) didn't play leads much but you knew he was good enough to. And I like his songs way more than Cobain's.

Neil Young is a very good guitarist. He just doesn't get fancy. He's like Gihn in that regard.

Malmsteen is a show-off. That doesn't impress me. My overall favorite guitarist is Robert Fripp. THAT is a guitar player. Another is Fred Frith who doesn't play fancy but is incredibly creative as a guitarist but also plays superb violin, excellent bass (he's bassist for Naked City), piano, vibes, mando, you name it. Proficiency isn't everything but it counts for a lot.

Well, I would certainly hope there's more scenes in Seattle than just grunge.

I never considered hair to be metal. And no I don't miss it. Can't miss what you weren't involved with.

When did I say you can't have an opinion? I can't stand Lady Gaga or Rihanna but do you see me on the Gaga or Rihanna threads busting people's balls for listening to them? No, you don't. Why? Because I don't give a damn. But when you're on MY thread, you're going to get MY opinions and you may not like 'em.

Yet you have no idea what even happened here unless it was on MTV.


I'm done with this, I'm satisfied that you've been exposed as to not knowing wtf you're talking about.

That is about a twenty years difference between the two scenes. Twenty years is a long time, and there a lot that can happen in that time, and a lot did happen for better and worse. So you have no qualms about genres in between those two scences say for example Disco, Day-glo 80s Pop, or Glam Metal but for whatever reason Seattle and Detroit rubs you the wrong way?

Wow really? Are you serious? or are you phrasing that like a rhetorical question?

Even if Kurt Cobain was the best playing lead guitar you can't fault him as a "hack" because he didn't pass himself off as the "greatest guitar you ever heard."

I don't think Grunge was unmusical - like it or lump it - it just had a different music sensibility about it.

No son, Pearl Jam were the best surely you should know that by now!

Same sort of thing happened 10 years earlier when punk and new-wave arrived circa 1976-1978.

I don't know why you guys are even arguing with Lord Hairlip, whose already demonstrated to us on several occasions, that he has no interest in anybody's opinion unless it mirrors his own. I'm guessing the guy joined the forum to finally learn something about music, problem is though, he's not learning anything as he's too wrapped up in the past to change now.

I mean how can somebody express a love for punk and not even be aware of who Thurston Moore is?

Or claim to revile "grunge" and the Seattle scene and not even know who Tommy Niemeyer, Kim Thayil or Jerry Cantrell are.