Not another 'state of hip-hop today' thread

[Captain Awesome]

Originally Posted by Jester

It's not more obvious, anyone has the ability to "diss" each other with music; perhaps instrumentals would be a lot more difficult, but there are plenty of genres where feuds can happen that aren't rap. Rap battles were a huge part of hip hop's history, and self promotion is a part of the game.

feuds do happen. Bands hate each other especially in the rock industry but they don't go around singing it.

There's more than one focus point in battling and rapping. How can you say bragging is a big part of rap and say "it's okay because it's an act." Okay, then gangsta rap is okay because it's an act. It's entertainment, and there's always room for creativity.

that's the problem with gangster rap and is exactly what i have been trying to say. They're acting gangster just to make money and fit in. When they shouldn't need to/want to do that.

Yes it was. It's a necessity because it allowed for so much expansion. Political rap and story telling excelled with gangsta rap, and not to mention, backpack and alternative rap come from opposing gangsta rap. All that "keepin' it real, not rappin' like i'm a gangsta" rap that you like comes from gangsta rap. I'm not acting like it's the first kind that existed, but it definitely caused the most expansion.

im tired of repeating myself. I've already spoken about this over and over you're just repeating yourself then i'm repeating myself it's extremely pointless.

You're repeating yourself because you're contradicting yourself. You're telling me that GANGSTA RAP SUCKS and then saying BUT THERE ARE SOME THAT I LIKE. Either say it all sucks or admit that it doesn't all suck.

No. Vin Diesel movies suck, he's a terrible actor. But they are entertaining. How can you not tell the difference? i might love boy bands but it doesn't make them good musicians. Big Pun, Big L, Big Daddy Kane, Royce 5'9, Tech N9ne. These are all very talented rappers but they don't seem to respect the talent they have. Instead of trying to do something with their music they're just trying to fit around the usual crap because it sells. Where as Ice Cube, Ludacris, Busta Rhymes can be entertaining but are talentless as rappers. They're just great actors and models they know how to make music sell, they don't know how to rap.

Gangsta rap has its place. If no one ever rapped about it, then there would be less diversity. Also, why the fuck would there not be gangsta rap? Songs are a reflection of our society, why shouldn't people rap about that?

I didn't say it shouldn't exist. Tupac, N.W.A these guys were breaking the mould they were doing things differently. They didn't do gangster rap specifically to make themselves millions and to look cool they did it to bring attention to the lives people like them were having to lead, to get the world to listen. You can't really compare brendas got a baby and express yourself to "the candy shop".

Yeah, I strongly believe that people should rap about (or talk about) what they want to. But freedom of speech isn't all I was talking about. Had you been paying attention, you would have realized that I mentioned to not put strain on the topics that an artist can select from.

blah blah blah - this is me repeating myself yet again. Go read my other posts they should answer all of your questions.

Lastly, give me a direct explanation as to why guns, drugs, or sex is for stupid people.

My point is that everyone thinks that's what rap is about now and they're wrong and they're stupid for thinking that. It's the same as everyone thinking metal is all about screaming really loud and playing instruments really fast. It's just a stupid stereotype because people are to ignorant to branch out and actually try and listen. And the rappers selling this stuff are far from stupid (they know how to make millions) they're just completely uncreative, and talentless as lyricists (therefore talentless as rappers).

replies in bold as usual.


Gangster rap was once great, it was very well done, the artists were creative and intelligent. They were trying to bring attention to the lives people were having to lead, trying to get people to do something about it to change it. But now it's all about how cool you are for living that life not how desperate you are to escape it. It's gotten to the point where it is destroying our culture.

"but its a time that I miss; you ask whats the difference,
Hip-Hop was then a culture, now hip-hop's a business"




to that other guy who said "Don't blame the genre, don't blame the lyricist. Blame the people who buy the music."

I am blaming them. But the artist doesn't have to write about that. They're choosing money over their passion. They're choosing to conform to what will make them money rather than staying true to themselves. It's the rappers fault just as much as the idiotic fans who actually buy this crap.

And T.I is definitley gangster rap, what else would you class him as? He sucks as a lyricist to. Name me an american mainstream rapper who doesn't.


Biggest problem really is that americans refuse to listen to rap unless it was made in america. I hate dividing rap by nationality but right now the only rap i can listen to is australian. Their rappers have the passion and the talent that american rappers had before it went from being a culture to a business.

[dark shadow]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

replies in bold as usual.



I am blaming them. But the artist doesn't have to write about that. They're choosing money over their passion. They're choosing to conform to what will make them money rather than staying true to themselves. It's the rappers fault just as much as the idiotic fans who actually buy this crap.

And T.I is definitley gangster rap, what else would you class him as? He sucks as a lyricist to. Name me an american mainstream rapper who doesn't.


Biggest problem really is that americans refuse to listen to rap unless it was made in america. I hate dividing rap by nationality but right now the only rap i can listen to is australian. Their rappers have the passion and the talent that american rappers had before it went from being a culture to a business.

do you know tech n9ne, big l, etc personally? just because you don't like the music they make doesn't mean they're conforming. if that is the music they think is the best use of their talent, that's their god-given right. you don't hold domain over what is and is not good source material. i understand the point you're trying to get across, but you sound incredibly pretentious in doing so.

as for TI, you're exactly right. He is MAINSTREAM rap. just because somebody raps about sex and drugs does not make it gangster rap. there is a large difference. and his lyrical ability is irrelevant to this conversation.

[anticipation]

Originally Posted by dark shadow

do you know tech n9ne, big l, etc personally? just because you don't like the music they make doesn't mean they're conforming. if that is the music they think is the best use of their talent, that's their god-given right. you don't hold domain over what is and is not good source material. i understand the point you're trying to get across, but you sound incredibly pretentious in doing so.

as for TI, you're exactly right. He is MAINSTREAM rap. just because somebody raps about sex and drugs does not make it gangster rap. there is a large difference. and his lyrical ability is irrelevant to this conversation.

exactly, gangster rap and our contemporary radio rap is not one in the same. associating the current rap scene with big pun, big l, or any other true gangster rapper is both libelous and retarded.

[Captain Awesome]

Originally Posted by anticipation

exactly, gangster rap and our contemporary radio rap is not one in the same. associating the current rap scene with big pun, big l, or any other true gangster rapper is both libelous and retarded.

are you a ****in retard? i already stated that big l, big pun, big daddy kane ect are/were talented lyricists.

and the **** you hear on the radio now IS gangster rap it's just not what it used to be it has changed into this mindless drivel we hear today. this is my whole ****in point.

i swear people just skim through posts now.

- Captain Awesome is no longer replying to this foolishness.

[anticipation]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

are you a ****in retard? i already stated that big l, big pun, big daddy kane ect are/were talented lyricists.

and the **** you hear on the radio now IS gangster rap it's just not what it used to be it has changed into this mindless drivel we hear today. this is my whole ****in point.

i swear people just skim through posts now.

- Captain Awesome is no longer replying to this foolishness.

yeah, and you're wrong. did you not read the post you just quoted? i'm saying to you that gangster rap is essentially dead, and that everything being done by top 40 rappers today cannot in any way, shape, or form be classified as gangster rap. the contemporary rap scene you loathe so deeply is pop rap, and G-Unit, Chingy, Lil Wayne, etc. are about as gangster rap as MC Hammer is.

[ProggyMan]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

are you a ****in retard? i already stated that big l, big pun, big daddy kane ect are/were talented lyricists.

and the **** you hear on the radio now IS gangster rap it's just not what it used to be it has changed into this mindless drivel we hear today. this is my whole ****in point.

i swear people just skim through posts now.

- Captain Awesome is no longer replying to this foolishness.

Lol.

[Kirby]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

Name me an american mainstream rapper who doesn't.

American Mainstream Rappers That Don't Suck:

Black Thought
KiD CuDi
Wale
Shwayze
Beastie Boys
Busta Rhymes (cross him off, because you think he's talentless)
Q-Tip
Chamillionaire
DMX
Jay-Z
Mike Shinoda (Fort Minor)
Method Man
Redman
Kanye West
Lupe Fiasco
Andre 3000
Big Boi
Raekwon
Talib Kweli

Edit: I'll wait.

Originally Posted by You

No. Vin Diesel movies suck, he's a terrible actor. But they are entertaining. How can you not tell the difference? i might love boy bands but it doesn't make them good musicians. Big Pun, Big L, Big Daddy Kane, Royce 5'9, Tech N9ne. These are all very talented rappers but they don't seem to respect the talent they have. Instead of trying to do something with their music they're just trying to fit around the usual crap because it sells. Where as Ice Cube, Ludacris, Busta Rhymes can be entertaining but are talentless as rappers. They're just great actors and models they know how to make music sell, they don't know how to rap.

If you've heard Tech's latest album, you will know that he isn't trying to conform, as much as a lot of people think he is. (Even I thought he was, with Sickology 101)

[Kirby]

Originally Posted by Kirby

American Mainstream Rappers That Don't Suck:

Black Thought
KiD CuDi
Wale
Shwayze
Beastie Boys
Busta Rhymes (cross him off, because you think he's talentless)
Q-Tip
Chamillionaire
DMX
Jay-Z
Mike Shinoda (Fort Minor)
Method Man
Redman
Kanye West
Lupe Fiasco
Andre 3000
Big Boi
Raekwon
Talib Kweli

Edit: I'll wait.

If you've heard Tech's latest album, you will know that he isn't trying to conform, as much as a lot of people think he is. (Even I thought he was, with Sickology 101)

Reposting this, because you completely ignored it, sir.

[Molecules]

Originally Posted by Kirby

American Mainstream Rappers That Don't Suck:

Black Thought
KiD CuDi
Wale
Shwayze
Beastie Boys
Busta Rhymes (cross him off, because you think he's talentless)
Q-Tip
Chamillionaire
DMX
Jay-Z
Mike Shinoda (Fort Minor)
Method Man
Redman
Kanye West
Lupe Fiasco
Andre 3000
Big Boi
Raekwon
Talib Kweli

Edit: I'll wait.



If you've heard Tech's latest album, you will know that he isn't trying to conform, as much as a lot of people think he is. (Even I thought he was, with Sickology 101)

well it's clear that any list with this agenda is going to be highly subjective, but chamillionare and mike f*cking shinoda? each to their own... but that just reinforces the points the article was making IMO

anyway, most of the MCs you've listed (and i'd wholeheartedly agree with you on) began their careers or released their most lauded albums in the mid/late-90s or earlier.
I don't know about Wale or anything, and i know you are more in touch with the current scene Kirby, but if i remember correctly the article addresses the rise of localized scenes (and mixtapes, some going viral) to make up for the deficit in the mainstream? I mean with your knowledge of hip-hop can you honestly say that Kanye West is the best the wider public deserves for lyricism?
Reynolds was having a go at the scum that floats to the top, not the whole damn show, and I seriously doubt that Q-Tip or Raekwon's latest solo albums (as good as they may have been) made a major dent in the charts... Unlike say, 'Enter the 36 Chambers' et al

[Engine]

Originally Posted by Molecules

I mean with your knowledge of hip-hop can you honestly say that Kanye West is the best the wider public deserves for lyricism?

Maybe I missed something but I thought he only said that K. West "doesn't suck" - to which I agree. That's a far cry from 'best lyricist'. Still, he's got a brain and it shows up sometimes in his rhymes - used to anyway..