You answered your own question.

My idea of hell is listening to a Primus album the whole way through.

Hope this helps

...explain. Vague statements leave me in the dark.

Thats just your preference Urban... But some people (like me) prefer music where bass plays a more than minor role over repetitive britpop crap where any form of originality is forbiddon.

See: Oasis.

If that was for me... If the song is centred around the bass, it's in context.
i.e; not being flash for the sake of it.
I'm agreeing with you.

But if it's a brilliant "bass solo" which adds nothing...it's bollocks.

Yeah but Oasis for all their faults write memorable songs which to me is far more important.

You ever been in a pub with about 200 people and they`ve all started singing a Primus song in unison?

Thought not.

side note that's kind of relevant. I play tuba in concert and marching band and I hate composeurs who give the bass line straight stacato notes. Music is suppose to be interesting and complex parts make music interesting.

That includes me, although I do love Britpop too.

I think that melody and rhythm should be shared, giving the song texture. Not always guitar guitar guitar. Balance is a wonderful thing

agreed.

I do too, i wasn't generalizing about the whole movement, i like most britpop bands, it's just certain popular bands who do nothing but imitate a bands style, instead of doing their own thing... Thats my problem with Oasis, i own Standing On The Shoulders Of Giants, i dig it, but more or less they're The Beatles with Syd Barret-esque vocals, nothing more, plus liking some of their music dosent really change my opinion about Noel and Liam being the most arrogant/pretentious jerks to ever become involved in the music business... And if theres anything worse than Noel and Liam putting Oasis on the same level as The Beatles, it would be Oasis fans doing the same thing.

Yeah but I find it funny how you mention a band like Oasis at me rather than someone else I likesuch as Talking Heads or Can which would be a perfect example of what i`m saying where the progression is in the music and the songs rather than one individual member showing off.

The progression is in the music?

What in the hell do you think makes the music?... Thats right, the instruments.

Did you not read the last line?

Would you like me to repeat it for the 6th or was it the 7th time?

And my... "who do I think is the best bassist" (seeing as I'm here) is, James Jamerson Motown Records 1959-1972.
He owned every song he ever played in, without dominating the tune.
Best bass player that ever lived. 1936-1983 RIP.

Les Claypool (sp?)

Ok Urban, but why should instruments only be reduced to a certain role?... Thats ridiculous, it demolishs all the potential a single instrument can have... You obviously love guitar driven music, but why is that good and bass driven music bad?... For some people, bass just sounds better than guitar, and for some bands, the role of guitar is reduced so bass can take over as the leading instrument, that isn't wanking at all, it isn't exactly showing off either... Its just changing the rules a little.

:eek: That's it, I'm cancelling my subscription to your newsletter.

I thought Urban was saying that he didn't appreciate music where any of the musicians were showing off, rather than focussing on guiding the song along.

I think power trios is a good example of why bass is important and more than just filler. I infact love power trios mm Cream. Power trios is music in its simplest form, Melody, Countermelody, Bass, Drums, take anything out and you're left with crap.

The greatest bassist of all time is James Jamerson, anyone who disagrees is wrong. :p:

He died at age 13?

EXACTLY.

Jack Bruce was very underrated, Cream were all about the riffs, but unlike many bands, their riffs were bass driven..... Clapton was just the icing on the cake, Bruce was the beating heart behind the music.

I hate any sort of music where it`s obvious one or several of the musicians are just doing it for one big ego trip , thats why I don`t listen to jazz.

First & foremost i`m a fan of songs , not guitars , not bass , not drums ...SONGS.

If a song is bass driven , fine
If a song is guitar driven , fine makes no difference to me.

Listen to any New Order song , Peter Hook plays his bass like a guitar but it`s never intrusive or detrimental to the song.He doesn`t feel the need to demonstrate how great he is every few minutes, he also writes great songs too.

I wonder if him not showing off all the time is why nobody in here has mentioned him , hmmmm.

psh its 1938-1983 making him 45

I'm not a fan of songs myself, i prefer music.

Excuse me, did you just call jazz a big wanking ego trip?... Dear god.... Is that really what you think?... What are you?... A rock n roll and nothing else type?.... A little narrow minded are we?... If all you like is that kinda thing, then fine, but you don't have to insult every kind of music you just don't happen to like and call it crap.

No

But you can`t deny some of it is

Edit: Oh look you edited it again afterwards , I never said it was crap I said it wasn`t to my taste

Why do you keep refering to it as showing off and ego driven, it bugs me. Some people talk about how a lot of music lacks talent but you're saying that these people need to dull themselves down? No. I'm all for it. Play your best. Impress me.

Call me stupid but i`d rather hear 5 great songs in a gig than a 20 minute bass / Guitar/ Drum solo

Who said anything about shows? I'm talking about on an album. I want people to show their talents in the studio and make great music.

DRMO...Fixed it, just for you.

Me too, but what makes a great song can vary.... It's not just some standard rock n roll fair with 2 minute songs... A verse/chorus/verse anthem with gibberish lyrics, a one note bassline, a guitar solo that mimics the chorus melody and a handclap section isn't all that consitutes a good song, open your eyes, theres much more to music than that... Listen to some classical or jazz, if you seriously consider it all wanking crap, then it seems that you have little appreciation for the evolution of music. :-/

:banghead:

Didn`t I just say I don`t have a problem with progression & musicianship as long as it works in the context of the song.

Yes, formula's suck. I just want to hear anything that sounds good.
This thread has gotten ridiculous. Bass is important. Plain and simple.

I do listen to classical , in fact thats one of the worst types of music you could have used to prove your point given the whole thing is conducted & anyone who tried to improvise or show off would be thrown out on his ear.

Your kidding...best part of the thread so far. Great debate.

Classical isn't know for its bass guitar work.

Some of the bassists that were suggested did make me think that 'good' can often equate to 'wank' (Jaco Pastorius for one. Technically amazing, but I've never heard a piece he played on that I liked... he even messed up that pop song with his farting bass), while others (like Wooten) really add a depth with their bass playing that supports what are already great songs.

All forms of classical music however, require a hell of a lot of technical efficiency to perform, timing is everything, and for a genre known for it's complex changes of time signatures and what not, timing is damn hard to keep up, every instrumentalist is showing off to some extent, cept maybe the guy who plays triangle, we all know that solo pieces are very damn important in classical music... Some forms of classical music is based completely around showing off... Neo classical being the ultimate example... Paginini did a lot of showing off, in fact, some consider him the first wanker, so to speak.

Oh but there is showing off in classical music. The Composeur he gets to choose what sections he wants to shine and many times there are bias's. And a lot of classical has extremely pertinant bass lines.

I think you could only aim that description at concertos, where the piano part was written by a piano virtuoso (Rachmaninov or Liszt for example) or the violin part was written by a great violinist (was Bruch?), as most orchestral or group classical was written with the overall sound in mind, not the complexities of the individual instrumental parts.

Yeah but thats the whole point of that type of music in the first place, thats how it`s written.

As I keep saying over & over again i`m talking about when it`s a detriment to the song.