jazzrocks

I listen to Frank Zappa he was of course very experimental. Some albums like Lumpy Gravy for the most is avant/musique concrete not really rock music. The Beatles put those techniques in more of a pop/rock song structure. I love Zappa but "Tomorrow Never Knows" is more influential than Lumpy Gravy even though musically I find the latter more interesting. Plus the Beatles actually initiated many innovations in rock music like backward guitar, Intentional feedback and Automatic Double Tracking to name a few. Zappa definitely influenced many musicians including the Beatles, Hendrix and even the Stones.

Rainard Jalen

I don't think Zappa was all that influential at all. Not influential of the main tide of popular music, anyway. Influential in oddball circles.

Radiohead90

I agree with you. I never got him. I rather listen to disco or rap.

Comus

Haha the last two posts are perhaps the two most stupid things I've ever heard.

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Rainard Jalen

Truth hurts, eh?

Zappa was not particularly influential with respect to popular music. He hardly wrote a good actual song (you know, those things you can sing along to??) in his whole career.

What he was, was a great experimental composer, avant-garde oddball and a brilliant comedian. He was not a hugely influential pop musician and there is absolutely nothing that could ever go any way to proving that he was. So boo f'cking hoo.

And Freak Out! is an awful collection of songs for which no amount of cleverness can change the fact that it simply FAILS as pop. It is hilarious that somebody would give esteem to a record like Freak Out! over something miles superior like Revolver.

Beatles and Radiohead have put out more worthy, memorable material on single albums than Zappa did in 2 decades of discography.

Comus

You're just compounding your ignorance with your argument, Freak Out! influenced the Beatles Sgt Peppers album which by your book probably influenced god in his creation of the world. Just checking the inaccurate tome of knowledge that is Wikipedia states that artists such as Black Sabbath cite Zappa as an influence.

Also you can sing along to a hell of a lot of Zappa's stuff, Sheik Yerbouti is an awesome collection of comedic poppish songs, and those more familiar with his discography will agree with me that pretty much every album has something that will get stuck in your head for weeks.

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Rainard Jalen

If it had any influence on Sgt Pepper, then that influence is EXTRAORDINARILY vague and obscure. In fact the extent of the influence was probably the notion of the concept album (truth is, neither Freak Out! nor Sgt Pepper were particularly concept albums at all). Again, whatever influence it had on Sgt Pepper is WAY too obscure and opaque to be worth mentioning, especially since it is not reflected in the music at all.

I don't care what Wikipedia says. I don't hear Zappa in Sabbath. Not even a tad. Who can honestly claim that they can?!!!

I'm familiar with his discography through to the bonkers jazz weirdness of the mid-70s.

The only things that ever got stuck in my head, ever, from Zappa, was 'Motherly Love' and 'Suzie Creamcheese', and not because either are good pop songs but because they're so patently absurd and ridiculous as to be pretty much unforgettable. I needed to go through total recall to stop their recurrence in my nightmares.

Anteater

Influence-wise, I'd give more props to The Velvet Underground, The Residents and Captain Beefheart than Zappa on the avant-garde side of things. But then again, If I had to stretch my arm out broadly, I'd say Jimi Hendrix (his whole damn career), King Crimson (20th Century Schizoid Man and the titular In the Court of the Crimson King were both landmark tracks) and Pink Floyd had more influence on rock than The Beatles by a landslide.

Actually, why even mention The Beatles at all in a thread like this when there are more interesting groups out there?

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Rainard Jalen

Um...because more artists actually listened to the Beatles than to any other act? Because in terms of melodic sensibilities, any band subsequent to the Beatles who made melody and harmony their music's main focus were most probably influenced by the Beatles? Or the point that their mere existence and stardom inspired many of the cutting edge acts of the 60s to become bands in the first place? Any seem like good reasons to me.

In terms of influence, there can be no denial of the Beatles' role. If you're talking innovation, wild experimentation and the cutting-edge, then of course many other 60s acts completely dwarf the Beatles...but this isn't about groundbreaking ideas and cutting-edge musical adventures, it's about mere influence.

jazzrocks

Funny King Crimson, Hendrix and Floyd all were influenced by the Beatles and used many of the elements of their psychedelic style.

George Harrison said and it's on You Tube when he recorded "Within You Without You" it was his goal to merge Traditional Indian Music with a Western Pop song. I don't know why this is a bad thing for some people? Using odd time signatures, exotic instruments and non western scales wrapped around melody driven music To me it's brilliant they were able to do it and it's a form of innovation.

Is it the Beatles fault that Zappa did not have the influence of them? You don't seem to get that pop music is a form of music. The Beatles merging progressive, experimental with pop music is a concept. They succeeded at it. Zappa non-pop experimental music did not. The Beatles experimental style of backward tapes, Indian Instruments, tape loops, and mellotron on "Tomorrow Never Knows" and "Strawberry Fields Forever" were done in 1966 before the Nice, Pink Floyd, Jimi Hendrix and King Crimson.


The Beatles already recorded songs with strong Avant Influence "Tomorrow Never Knows", "Love You To", "Strawberry Fields Forever", "A Day in the Life". The Beach Boys were miles late with "Smiley Smile. Like who cares if the Beatles also did their share of pop music. The Beatles also experimented. They did not play one type of music. Ah by the way this was before Pink Floyd and years before King Crimson were recording.