Originally Posted by eric generic (Post 1036582)

first of all, I'm a huge Kobe fan. he's been my favorite player to watch for some time now. he's such a complete player.

comparing him to MJ? Kobe has no case. just take a look at their playoff stats.

I'd much rather take LeBron as he is. there's too many wife-beaters and drunk drivers around as it is.

he left cleveland because their management did a laughably terrible job in free agency and the draft. I don't blame him at all.

I don't recall him ever saying he didn't want the ball in his hands with the game on the line. not everyone can be Kobe. if LeBron would ever improve his game(jumper, post offense, and lock-down 1v1 defense) he could be the most dominant ever, but he seems to be content doing what he has been his entire career.

let me show you a pic of a player with no heart:
http://www.clipperscurse.com/wp-cont...ncecarter1.jpg

now let me show you LeBron's career averages:
27.7ppg / 7apg / 7.1rpg / 1.7spg / .8 bpg

he has heart.

granted, his effort was questionable last year in the playoffs because he already knew he was gonna be a MoHeato...

Originally Posted by Boozinbloozin (Post 1036594)

Comparing Kobe to Jordan isnt that far fetched of an idea. Yes I will take a look at playoff stats as you should take a look at the all team leading sports scorers. Jordans not that far ahead of Kobe in that department. Im not saying that at this time Kobe is the better player but if a case is to be made. Kobe could be the only one with enough credentials to even consider it at this time.



Personally the end of that video I could care less about. The arrogance and selfishness doesnt bother me at all. The lack of desire to win or not be the man does. Big time players make big time plays...for all its complexity in the game of basketball that simple statment rings true for every sport. You keep Lebron and keep calling yourself a Kobe fan though.

Originally Posted by Boozinbloozin (Post 1036602)

I dont think this is a Lebron favoritism thing as much as it is a strength in numbers against me thing. Which is fine...unlike Lebron ill stick around to debate my end of the argument despite the enevitable. Dirty I do at least respect the fact that you just plain dont like Kobe and thats your opinion. I dont like Lebron and as far as Kobe wanting out of Los Angelos fact remains he didnt leave. There were also issues with him and Phil Jackson as well but those were resolved.
As far as the first three rings with Shaq who is say they woudnt have won any without him? Its a good thing that rings dont matter as well that way at the end of the season they can just call it quits and go home. Its not like that has anything to do with the amount of work they put in during the season. That would probally be right up Lebrons alley...that way he wouldnt have to worry about choking come crunch time and dishing the ball to someone else. So they could be the one to take the heat of losing. Yeah rings dont matter what so ever in sports they are just for television marketing purposes.*sarcasm*

Originally Posted by Dirty (Post 1036604)

If Kobe would have been a free agent he probably would have left. He spent days going on radio shows bashing how own management and demanded a trade. But Lakers management knew exactly what they were doing and sure enough, Bynum is now awesome. And for the rings he won with Shaq, I am saying Kobe would have never sniffed those rings without Shaq.Shaq won the MVP of those Finals all 3 times and had the highest scoring average for a center in the finals EVER. Cmon, Kobe was still good back then but he was a totally different player and Shaq was the one carrying the team on his back. MJ never had anyone else carrying the load for him. It was ALWAYS on his back and he always delivered. There is NO way in hell those Laker teams would have even made the finals without Shaq.

Tons of players leave their teams for better teams in hopes of winning a title. I never hear Shaq catch any shit. Carmello publicly said he wanted of Denver for months, and he was viewed as a hero or something for leaving. Amare left Phoenix for New York... I mean cmon it's happened with superstars for generations. This hate for LeBron is just absurd and ridiculous. He is the most hated guy in basketball for wanting to have a better chance at winning a championship and taking less money to do it lol. Makes no sense to me.

And also the LeBron isn't clutch stuff makes no sense to me. Again, LBJ haters just hating instead of being realistic and appreciating. The guy scored like 22 points in a row VS the pistons a few years ago in the playoffs, but instead they wanna diss him for not being able to win a championship with a bunch of bums as team mates. I just don't get why LeBron is so under appreciated. We are probably never going to see a player like this ever again. Don't hate, appreciate!

Originally Posted by Boozinbloozin (Post 1036614)

Ill give that on the MJ point you made definatley. Mj did have a good squad around him but never the likes of a Shaq. Still if I had to pick a player to make a case with it would be Kobe not Lebron.

As far as all of the hate that Lebron gets for leaving. I think its because whether he realized it or not he was the next in line to be a Jordan or Kobe. I mean he was called King James out of highschool wasnt he? They were crowning him best ever before he set foot on an NBA court. I think he was loving every minute of it and rightfully so but just didnt realize the frusrations and pressure that entails. Jordan was 28 years old before he won a title. Its not all a fairy tale when you get to the pro's. Thats just my opinion but ive never won **** in any athletic competition. Lets take a look at what the best player to ever play the game says about the whole thing. Also make note of who he mentions would be good competition out of the players of today.

Originally Posted by Dirty (Post 1036616)

Well I can understand Kobe being closest to MJ because I think Kobe does have a killer instinct type of mentality that LeBron lacks. Even though I think sometimes Kobe goes into fake-tough guy mode or something. Thank you for that video though because I just love hearing Michael Jordan speak lol. Does anyone else feel this way? I've never heard a Jordan interview and thought "man this guy is bullshitting." Sorry, I just love MJ. Him and Ken Griffey jr. are my absolute sports heroes, they are gods to me lol.

But ok, enough with the MJ comparisons talk... Ok, to me the reason we will never see another LeBron is because he was on the Sports Illustrated cover as a high schooler and hyped to be an all-time great before he even set foot on the NBA court. Like I can't think of a single athlete who has ever had close to as much hype as Lebron at that age... It's a ridiculous amount of pressure and expectations, and he somehow surpassed all of them. It's just insane lol. To be 18 and have the pressure on you to save a franchise and be one of the best players in the game, and he turns a last place team into a first place team within a couple of seasons and wins back to back MVPs. And unlike most people, I do think LeBron is a pretty humble and gracious guy. I do wish he had a killer instinct and played more pissed off, and I wish he would work on the stuff eric talked about. Like his shooting, post offense and 1 on 1 defense. But he is still the best player in the league, I mean nobody is absolutely perfect.

Ok I guess I just really appreciate greatness and try to put it into context while it's happening. Like I realize LeBron is someone my grandkids will marvel over. Same with guys like Kobe and Shaq. Same in other sports with Pujols. And for lebron I just don't feel like he is appreciated for how awesome he is. I mean, cmon the lockouts and stuff in sports should give fans a wake up call that sports are a business and there doesn't have to be loyalty in sports, there hardly is. I just don't get the big deal as to why it's like the worst thing ever that LBJ ditched shitty Cleveland for Miami. Yeah of course Jordan and Bird and those guys didn't want to leave, their franchises put great teammates all around them. Bird played on a team of hall of famers and Jordan was playing with the best rebounder in the league, 2 of the best defenders in the league, and perfect role guys. The only thing I can knock LeBron on so far was the playoffs last year, when he definitely checked out. He just seemed disinterested or something, it was weird to see.


Also, eric you are completely right about Vince Carter. In that case, heart was the difference between good and great.