Contact with thread starter before a thread is closed

[Key]

Originally Posted by TheBig3

you just wanted to start a thread like this with nothing in mind?

Is that so hard to believe? To be completely honest with you, I was thinking about this idea while I was taking a shower yesterday morning. There wasn't anything from this forum beforehand relating to those thoughts, they were just thoughts, and I wanted to express those thoughts with the rest of the forum.

[VEGANGELICA]

Originally Posted by Ki

If I could take anything from my OP and have it be more specific, it'd be to contact the thread starter. I just find that if the person who started the thread is aware that their original topic is being taken away from the thread, i'd think they'd like some notification as to what's happening and why it's happening and hopefully they can resolve it. I'm not saying to do this on every thread that's closed, obviously. It'd sort of be like putting more responsibility on the person who started the thread, and perhaps it would allow for people to see how much people enjoy seeing their threads be a success.

Ki, I agree with you completely that non-duplicate threads made by legitimate posters should not be closed, even if the topic meanders or is considered "stupid" by mods, unless the original poster (when available) requests and/or okays the closure.

If people are getting horribly off-topic or vicious in a thread, rather than close the thread so that no one else can participate in the discussion, I recommend mods focus on the members who seem to be violating rules.

Closing a thread to end bickering will just result in that bickering moving elsewhere. Also, thread closure deprives other members of a chance to participate in a discussion they may find interesting.

* * *

Originally Posted by Urban Hat€monger ?

That's because I remember when this place had some standards & people weren't afraid to say to someone 'This thread is stupid, make more of effort.'

Stupid is subjective. Even if a mod thinks a thread topic is stupid doesn't mean everyone else will.

I'd much rather that thread topics reflect what individual non-mod members feel are interesting and valuable, not just what mods think. I feel the beauty of MB is that one can find any topic anyone could ever imagine discussed here...and many I would have never thought of! I like those best...threads like, "What's your favorite Pringles' tube color?"

This month I saw a thread in which people bashed the thread topic as boring and then targeted the original poster rather than discussing her or his topic. Rather than being a high point in MB's history, I felt those rude responses were a low point, and very off-putting to the OP. Saying some topic is stupid or boring in the thread itself is also off topic!

If having "standards" means the right to act like jerks to people for expressing their ideas, then I think it is a good thing if MB lacks "standards."

Originally Posted by Urban Hat€monger ?

your taking the assumption that the topic can be salvaged all the time.

If I close a thread permanently it's because a thread asking something dumb like 'What is your favourite colour Pringles tube' has gone massively off topic.

Ordinarily I would close a thread like that after the first post for being so idiotic but then I get called things like trigger happy, so I decide to leave it open. Because it's a dumb thread it soon gets filled up with crap and off topic arguments.
So I close it, because a topic so dumb really doesn't need salvaging and then I get called trigger happy again.

So in short, start proper threads and don't instigate topics a 4 year old would find stupid and this won't happen.

Thank you for holding back and keeping threads open when you yourself feel the topic is stupid.

About the question of who should decide what a "proper" thread topic is, assuming it relates to music in the music forums and non-music in the lounge threads, I say leave it up to the community.

If members give honest replies to a thread topic, then I'd say that means it is "proper." And even if no one replies now, perhaps someone will later. I feel a hands off approach is better than over-moderation.

* * *

Originally Posted by sopsych

Part of what's wrong is too much fighting, off-putting to new people and some of us who have been here a while.

I have seen the ban-from-thread feature used on another forum. (On me. For a weird reason, a rule specific to that site.) If it can be implemented here for proper usage, try it. But from what I've seen, it's not one-on-one fights that are a problem; it is usually multiple people against one. If people are chronically starting fights, more than banning from threads needs to be done. Sometimes the attacking is a response to suspected trolling.[/venting]

As usual, sopsych, I agree with you about fighting in threads being off-putting, especially when it is multiple people against one, such as in these off-topic comments by mods aimed at you...

Originally Posted by Pedestrian

Perhaps you should stop starting arguments then.

and...

Originally Posted by Janszoon

Let me guess, everyone was against you there too.

...however, sopsych, I'd rather let the fighting happen (but have mods warn members in private) and keep threads open unless the OP requests closure.

Also, when threads go off-topic, I'd rather let the threads meander or have mods address the meanderers instead of close the thread.

I remember when your thread about liking shorter songs got closed because we were discussing the possible relationship between drug use and people's preferences for song length. Since a mod closed your thread, I ended up continuing the discussion of drugs and the type of music people produce or prefer in another thread. During that process, I learned about "narcotica" music and the way drugs affect the mind's tolerance for longer songs. The discussion resulting from your thread topic was useful and interesting to me. I felt your thread was closed for no reason and discussion was squelched, simply because mods didn't like the topic and the direction it was taking.

As an MB user, I don't like it when discussions I enjoy are stopped. When that happens, I'd rather that mods just focus on deleting obvious spam (ads for toasters, etc.) and stay out of music threads in which they don't like the topic but other MB members do.

[Burning Down]

Originally Posted by VEGANGELICA

Ki, I agree with you completely that non-duplicate threads made by legitimate posters should not be closed, even if the topic meanders or is considered "stupid" by mods, unless the original poster (when available) requests and/or okays the closure.

I try to merge duplicate threads, but since there's been a problem with post and thread merging across VBulletin forums (like MB) lately, the best I can do is post a link to the existing thread before I close the new one.

Edit: I'm stupid. I misread your post

[Scarlett O'Hara]

Originally Posted by Ki

I know it's always a long shot to request something to happen to the forum, but there's is a plug-in/hack for vBulletin that can allow thread bans for specific users:

Ban Users From a Thread - vBulletin.org Forum

The owner set it up at my other forum, and it works wonders. You can set how long you want them to be banned from the thread, or just keep the banned permanently. It works the same way as regular banning does.

That is awesome! Yeah I don't think it's always possible to talk to people about their threads first, it just depends on the circumstances. We do try to tell people through PM why their thread was closed or as the last post of the thread.

I don't think you can rely on the thread starter to keep the thread on track because not everyone returns and they shouldn't be responsible for poor behaviour/circular arguements, unless they're involved.

[Key]

Originally Posted by Vanilla

I don't think you can rely on the thread starter to keep the thread on track because not everyone returns and they shouldn't be responsible for poor behaviour/circular arguements, unless they're involved.

Under certain circumstances, it's completely understandable why the thread starter can't keep his thread up to date and interesting, however I know a lot of people, like myself do take a lot of time in thinking of the best way to bring up the topic that we're creating the thread about. The more effort somebody puts into a thread, the more interesting it will look and the more likely a person is to read it. I don't know if most people are the same as I am, but I get easily drawn into something when it's colorful and not of the norm. Ped's threads for example, I absolutely love what she does with the images she puts in the beginnings of her threads, they're attention grabbing and they draw me in. However in some cases, more is probably too much. I don't know, I feel like i'm babbling now.

[Scarlett O'Hara]

I understand, I suppose it would be voluntary for people to keep control of their threads but personally I think mod's can just be directive if we need to.

[Key]

Originally Posted by Vanilla

I understand, I suppose it would be voluntary for people to keep control of their threads but personally I think mod's can just be directive if we need to.

Understandable. I'm not saying anything negative about the mods, you guys do a fine job and this place is always spotless. I was just bringing up an alternative approach if it was ever needed, that's all.

[Scarlett O'Hara]

Thanks for mentioning it anyway, it's worth discussing.

[Janszoon]

Originally Posted by VEGANGELICA

As usual, sopsych, I agree with you about fighting in threads being off-putting, especially when it is multiple people against one, such as in these off-topic comments by mods aimed at you...

and...

Wow, Vegan. Just wow. Fully siding with the trolls now, eh? No sense of context whatsoever. Apparently it's totally okay with you if Sopsych makes hostile, off-topic posts, but heaven forbid anyone respond to them.

I've refrained from weighing in against your comments in this part of the site for a very long time because I've always respected you and your opinion even when I didn't agree with it. Thanks for letting me know the respect wasn't mutual. I'll be sure to take the gloves off from now on.

[TheBig3]

Originally Posted by Ki

Is that so hard to believe? To be completely honest with you, I was thinking about this idea while I was taking a shower yesterday morning. There wasn't anything from this forum beforehand relating to those thoughts, they were just thoughts, and I wanted to express those thoughts with the rest of the forum.

Yeah...it is.

The current system seems to work fine. If you want my honest opinion, I think these Mods close threads way too early, but its not as if you're suggesting they stop. You're hoping to just write policy for a forum that doesn't need policy for this issue.

If you don't have an example of a thread that was executed poorly, then I don't know what you're after. I think about a lot of things while I'm shampooing my mop - its best we don't post everything we think while bathing.