Are you religious?

DeadChannel · 11-15-2015, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Wilkes Booth

i disagree my friend

for the simple reason that you will never convince the vast bulk of religious people to be rational

Probably true, but that doesn't mean it's not worth having the conversation, if only to place your views of the world under the scrutiny of others.

Quote:

and even most atheists are irrational and only parrot talking points fed to them by the intelligentsia

That's probably true to an extent, but at least we're right

Quote:

added to the fact that religious people have a significant emotional investment in their religion, to the extent that it has shaped our practices, rituals, sense of art and beauty etc and they simply aren't going to be moved from that rock

No, but that doesn't mean that religion ought to be off limits. Also, it appears that at least in the west, rates of religiosity are going down, and irreligiosiry going up. So, clearly, having the debate has some effect.

Quote:

so all you'll do by being a militant atheist is create yet another unnecessary schism in the human race, by stirring up resentment from the other side

The problem is that people shouldn't hate each other over a disagreement. The moment that people get mad about each other views instead of trying to refute them is the moment that discourse goes down the toilet.

Quote:

like really who is helped by taking a nativity scene down? i'm an atheist, i live in the south, you think i give a **** that the townhall has a nativity scene? give me a break. what motivates people to put up that nativity scene is honoring a tradition and celebrating a holiday. what motivates the atheist alliance from freedom foundation or whateverthe**** to try to take it down is "HEY! THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ME. I'M HERE TOO. SOMEBODY NOTICE ME."

I agree. I don't see anything wrong with nativity scenes, and I think it's a waste of time to oppose them, but that doesn't mean that there aren't problems worth perusing. For instance, opposition to gay marriage, religiously-motivated discrimination, or the opposition to teaching actual science in the science classroom.

Quote:

nah sit down and shut up you ratchet looking atheist bitch

Ah, yes, John Wilkes Booth is back.

The Batlord · 11-15-2015, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeadChannel

No, but that doesn't mean that religion ought to be off limits. Also, it appears that at least in the west, rates of religiosity are going down, and irreligiosiry going up. So, clearly, having the debate has some effect.

I think that's a tiger-repelling rock. If anything it's just that people have lots of **** like supermarkets and television to make life feel less bleak, and so they don't feel the need to obsess over an afterlife to save them from the Bubonic plague and fleas. I think religion's decline in the West is just apathy for beliefs that most people still claim to have. Increased atheism is just the chicken coming after the egg.

**Janszoon** · 11-15-2015, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Wilkes Booth

like really who is helped by taking a nativity scene down? i'm an atheist, i live in the south, you think i give a **** that the townhall has a nativity scene? give me a break. what motivates people to put up that nativity scene is honoring a tradition and celebrating a holiday. what motivates the atheist alliance from freedom foundation or whateverthe**** to try to take it down is "HEY! THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ME. I'M HERE TOO. SOMEBODY NOTICE ME."

nah sit down and shut up you ratchet looking atheist bitch

No, what motivates them is the fact that it's a violation of church and state separation. You can certainly argue about whether or not that's a good strategy for fighting that battle, but mischaracterizing it just makes it sound like you don't know what you're talking about.

ladyislingering · 11-15-2015, 05:05 PM

nope

Jesus would take one look at my life, shake his head, and proooobably give me some penicillin.

I am a disgrace.

DwnWthVwls · 11-15-2015, 05:35 PM

I support the separation between church and humans.

The Batlord · 11-15-2015, 05:59 PM

I support the separation of church and young boys.

DeadChannel · 11-15-2015, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

I support the separation of church and young boys.

I feel like this ought to be sigged.

The Batlord · 11-15-2015, 06:15 PM

I felt good when I posted that. Real good.

~~John Wilkes Booth~~ · 11-15-2015, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeadChannel

Probably true, but that doesn't mean it's not worth having the conversation, if only to place your views of the world under the scrutiny of others.

i'm all for debate. i was saying i don't like the militant athiest approach to debate.

Quote:

That's probably true to an extent, but at least we're right

the one true church, as the pope would say

Quote:

No, but that doesn't mean that religion ought to be off limits. Also, it appears that at least in the west, rates of religiosity are going down, and irreligiosiry going up. So, clearly, having the debate has some effect.

previously atheism was literally repressed... so clearly making it more of a mainstream concept is going to make it more popular

Quote:

The problem is that people shouldn't hate each other over a disagreement. The moment that people get mad about each other views instead of trying to refute them is the moment that discourse goes down the toilet.

yea... but my fundamental thing here is atheists should think twice about the idea that we should work/strive towards a world without religion. cause that basically sets us on a collision course with these people.

Quote:

I agree. I don't see anything wrong with nativity scenes, and I think it's a waste of time to oppose them, but that doesn't mean that there aren't problems worth perusing. For instance, opposition to gay marriage, religiously-motivated discrimination, or the opposition to teaching actual science in the science classroom.

i completely agree... or more important than any of that, open the liquor store on sundays and on time god damnit

Quote:

Ah, yes, John Wilkes Booth is back.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon

No, what motivates them is the fact that it's a violation of church and state separation. You can certainly argue about whether or not that's a good strategy for fighting that battle, but mischaracterizing it just makes it sound like you don't know what you're talking about.

no... what motivates them is exactly what i said. what gives them a legal case is what you said. they cite the establishment clause of the first amendment, which says something like "congress shall not respect any institution of religion" or some****, not seperation of church and state which is a revisionist interpretation of said clause.

but it could be they're technically right about the establishment clause, and townhall nativity scenes are completely unconstitutional. even so... i'm a advocate of picking your fights... and this one seems to have little to no pragmatic value, it's simply a symbolic fight. and pragmatically we just end up looking like a bunch of grinches, so it might as well be an anti-atheism smear campaign.

The Batlord · 11-15-2015, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Wilkes Booth

i'm all for debate. i was saying i don't like the militant athiest approach to debate.

the one true church, as the pope would say

previously atheism was literally repressed... so clearly making it more of a mainstream concept is going to make it more popular

yea... but my fundamental thing here is atheists should think twice about the idea that we should work/strive towards a world without religion. cause that basically sets us on a collision course with these people.

i completely agree... or more important than any of that, open the liquor store on sundays and on time god damnit

no... what motivates them is exactly what i said. what gives them a legal case is what you said. they cite the establishment clause of the first amendment, which says something like "congress shall not respect any institution of religion" or some****, not seperation of church and state which is a revisionist interpretation of said clause.

but it could be they're technically right about the establishment clause, and townhall nativity scenes are completely unconstitutional. even so... i'm a advocate of picking your fights... and this one seems to have little to no pragmatic value, it's simply a symbolic fight. and pragmatically we just end up looking like a bunch of grinches, so it might as well be an anti-atheism smear campaign.

Yeah, even to most casual atheists Christmas is just a cultural holiday that is important for family ****, and so they don't worry about separation of church and state. Bitching about Nativity scenes is what makes atheists call themselves agnostics.

View Poll Results: What religion do you follow?
Christianity	38	20.32%
Buddhism	3	1.60%
Hinduism	1	0.53%
Islam	2	1.07%
Judaism	4	2.14%
Wiccanism	1	0.53%
Other established religion (feel free to post about it)	6	3.21%
Self-defined	25	13.37%
Don't follow any religion & don't believe in deities (atheist)	68	36.36%
Not Sure, undecided, don't know or don't care	39	20.86%
Sikhism	0	0%
Voters: 187. You may not vote on this poll

11-15-2015, 05:05 PM	#404 (permalink)
ladyislingering Maelian Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Seattle Posts: 695	nope Jesus would take one look at my life, shake his head, and proooobably give me some penicillin. I am a disgrace. __________________ You and I, We were born to die.