Originally Posted by crukster

My friend, you've already proven it with your assumptions on my ethnic kin.


There's a lot more to life than the words compassion and love. Take your compassion and love to the darkest corners of the globe and see how far they get you.

Establish a society based on your "compassion and love" and see how long it lasts.

If you don't want to follow a faith, or pledge to a religion, that's your own decision. But any sane, morally upstanding person on the planet, whether they're religious or not, can't deny the inherent practicality, functionality, and pure basic righteousness of the Abrahamic system. Either you don't know it well enough, in which case, study. Or you do know it, and you think the whole lesson of love thy neighbour, love thy Planet, love and assist your fellow Human in the name of Humanity and Almighty God is MOOT and worthless.

In which case this discussion is moot and worthless, because you're obviously using the word "moral" as some sort of semantic wordplay, referring to the idea of appeasement and a good looking "social image."

Fuk social image that's as fickle as a cat. What WORKS is better than what "looks nice". I'm talking about doing actual good, actual progressive things, having a clean heart and mind and approaching the World for what it is. You don't HAVE to be religious to do that.

If you do that, though, you'd have no problem with religion itself, only the people that corrupt it. Because religion itself is the establishment OF those rules and ideas, passing them down to each generation, building on them and continuing to progress. If you think a certain idea that's been passed down has been corrupted, or isn't functional, then fine, sure that's your own intelligent right and let's all look into it.

But at the very basic core of what RELIGION is, set aside any specific religion, but religion itself, at it's core:

Well it's the idea of writing down what works, and passing it on to the next group of people. So that they dont spend a long time kicking around in the mud, trying to solve the same problems that were solved a millenia ago.

We have new problems. We've got a healthy body but rotten leaves. And you wanna pull up the tree by the roots and start over?

Before you can even do that, anyway, you would have to be an expert on every religion in order to say that every tenent in EVERY religion, every rule, every moral, every guideline, is wrong.

Thou shalt not Kill, is that wrong?

Thou shalt not steal, is that wrong?

Honour thy Mother and thy Father, is that wrong?

You see where I'm going with this.

I'm not saying people should neccessarily follow them unquestionably, or that they should follow them because they've been "told" to, or that they should follow them for fear of Hell. I'm not saying that at all. I am saying they should follow them because they choose to, because they believe in them, and because they recognise their practicality in the real World.

Hell, I AM going to Hell. That's what Islam says - me, you, everyone, regardless of what you believe, burns in the flames as penance relative to their sins. Who can say they've never sinned, never done anything they knew was wrong? But through that penance you understand your sins and progress onwards to Paradise, Heaven; whatever that may be - EVERYONE. So long as they accept their sins and understand the functionality of the Universe. How long you burn is up to you. Not that I'm judging or anything, simply stating what I believe. If you disagree and think I'm crazy, so-be-it, good luck to you man. That's your choice, if you like fire, play with fire, what can I say.

I'm not saying be a sheep and follow the herd. I'm also saying don't go to the other extreme and be a stubborn sheep and stop the herd.

I'm saying stop being a SHEEP. Be a shepherd. Be a Human. Don't form ideaologies adjacent or parallel or "anti-" to others, because when they fall, you'll fall with them. I am saying form intelligent functional ideas, that will welcome any shared goal with any group, because the ideas are functional, and intelligent I.E. It is important what you DO, not what you call it. Muslim, Jew, Christian, Buddhist, Agnostic hell even "atheist" - I don't give a ****, I care about what people DO.

If you write off every religion just because it's a source of authority, then you're as bad as the fundamentalists.

I am saying approach religious ideas with an intelligent mind, apply what works, and fix what doesn't.

I am saying have faith in Existence.

Have faith in Almighty God.





It's personally speaking - if I weren't religious I wouldn't call myself an atheist. I'd just say "I'm not religious, I have no belief about that stuff"

Either it factors into your life and the way you approach things, if that's the case you are religious.

Or it doesn't and you're simply not a religious person.

I don't like labels, maybe some people like the term atheist because it gives a collective "group" to the non-believers, a collective "voice"

well if I weren't religious, I wouldn't want a collective voice, personally. I'd just have my own voice. Because I think if you want to lend your voice to a "collective voice" or group, then it's better to actually have something to say, instead of just "I don't believe in what those other groups are saying", get what I'm saying?

Like I said, I don't care, it matters more what people do. I just think the name is innaccurate, and I think a lot (not neccessarily all) of "atheists" aren't doing good things for the Planet. The idea of atheism is self-defeating imo.

Originally Posted by crukster

The goal of atheism ultimatly as a group, which is what it is, is to eradicate all religion.

Originally Posted by Schranz bass

Religion and all religious people need to be extinguished. It is the religious mentality that is holding humanity back. Religion is for people who don't know how to be good. WHen you prattle on that humans can't be good without religion I can tell you have the E.Q. of a rotting orange peel.

Originally Posted by mord

Actually, I like you a lot, Nea. That's why I treat you like ****. It's the MB way.

Originally Posted by Neapolitan

Schranz Bass;

Hello and please to meet you, I know I don't know you from Adam but I think have to tell you something a whole orange doesn't have an intellect let alone part of it - an orange peel.
(btw is that Bass that rhymes with ace or Bass that that rhymes with ass?)

Originally Posted by crukster

I wouldn't say it's what I'm doing, cos imo it's perfectly justifiable to "bash" the "bashers" - stance of defense, not aggression.

I don't think all atheists are scumbags, no. I just can't respect the idea, it seems infantile to me. "The grouped of non-group-eds"

For example - the bus ads in the UK. Some Christian group put out an ad saying smething like

"Have faith in God live a good life" etc. your general "We love Jesus" sort of thing

So what do the local "atheist non-theocratic committee of non-commited non-group" group do?

Put out an ad saying

"There is no God. Live your life"

If atheism is not a group, if atheism is not a religion, why would they feel they need to counter a message like that? The goal of atheism ultimatly as a group, which is what it is, is to eradicate all religion.

Maybe individual atheists have no problem with religion, but as a group, that is the main agenda. If they're trying to spread atheism with ads like that, that means they want as many atheists as possible - they want to expand and spread their message. Therefore, they want to eradicate religion, pretty simple man.

If you are how you say, then People like yourself aren't the ones I have a problem with, and I think by calling yourself atheist you're actually allying yourself with something more than just non-believing. So long as people are half-decent, I can respect it if they say "piss off I'm not joining your group I dont believe" - their choice.

I can't respect it if they say, "piss off I'm not joining your group, I'm gonna go join this other group for people who don't wanna be in your group " because they've made it competitive.

It's like making it the "cliques" of the world, thats stupid.

If you don't believe, fine. If you believe different to me, fine.

If you begrude me my belief, thats not fine.


Just as though, I said - don't have a problem with religion, have a problem with the people who corrupt it.

Well same principle; I have no problem with a lack of religion. I have a problem with people who corrupt the non-religious.

atheism is a cult imo.

Originally Posted by Dirty

I don't see how atheism is a cult any more than christianity or islam or any other religion. You seem to have a warped sense of what atheism is. I imagine you view atheism as some big club or something.

Groups OF atheists exist. If a religious group wants to put out their message, why don't you think its okay for an atheist group to do the same?

Originally Posted by Dirty

Groups OF atheists exist. If a religious group wants to put out their message, why don't you think its okay for an atheist group to do the same? I think it's stupid for either group to advertise like the example you talked about, since all it does is turn the non-believers off even more, but why can one group promote their "message" and the other group can't? I feel like atheists like that are more concerned with showing people that they can be good people and live great lives without a religion. Which is entirely true and I don't really see a problem with it other than thinking religious advertising of any kind is stupid.

Originally Posted by Schranz bass

WHat is this? The 13th century? Forget atheism. It is false reasoning.

Secular humanism is more appropriate.

Try it out