Unpopular Music Opinions

Neapolitan · 08-12-2011, 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by unknown soldier

i`d say most of what you`ve written in regards to prog as popular genre finally merging into either pomp or just plain aor was mostly correct, because by the mid to late 70s there were a lot of bands which had they been around half a decade earlier, would`ve been playing prog as opposed to pomp or aor, but also genres such as punk, new-wave and nwobhm etc by the late 70s had become so popular, that the trend for longer and more technical songs had died out.

There is a irony in that "the trend for longer ...songs had died out." because in the 80's disco and dance song became extended. So the "long song" only died for a while then was reborn in another genre in another decade.

Quote:

Originally Posted by unknown soldier

quite correctly though, marillion proved there was still a market for traditional prog at least here in the uk where they were very popular. In fact marillion didn`t really bring anything new to the table and were just content to put out a prog sound that was almost identical to peter gabriel era genesis, but this time they weren`t called prog but neo-prog rock!

Another good Neo thing about the 80's - Neo-Psychedelia.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ska lagos jew sun ra

disco's changes weren't just on it's audience, moreso, they were changes which effected the format of music, how it was recorded, distributed, and presented. Proof a larger audience can be procured with less expensive techniques

ie. People don't go to disco concerts they go to disco clubs.

prog requires excessive production costs, procures a much smaller audience, and is much more difficult to advertise, and distribute. Disco presented the industry with a lot of what the release model is for 'pop' music today. Already being easily accessible, it could be made massively popular by market flooding where more complex music is difficult to fit.

After all, prog very evidently exists in the 80s and 90s and 00s, it's just not as high budget, or emphasized, and that's only in general.

Yes basically you're proving my point they're wordls apart. Their worlds are so far apart I don't see it really effecting each other. To me it like saying an asteroid that collided with Mars killed the dinosaurs on Earth.
Prog side stepped Glam Pub by it (Prog) not being a Top 40 so even though some punk fans disliked that genre it I think it is difficult to prove Punk killed Prog. There's some continuity running through Glam, Pub and into Punk and New Wave and Prog was in it's on world altogether really not on the Pop charts like the other genres mentioned. And New Wave and Prog weren't opposing musical genres there were the former influenced Prog bands.

Necromancer · 08-13-2011, 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neapolitan

To me it like saying an asteroid that collided with Mars killed the dinosaurs on Earth.

That's defiantly an unpopular opinion concerning the scientific study of celestial objects and phenomena.

Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra · 08-13-2011, 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neapolitan

Yes basically you're proving my point they're wordls apart. Their worlds are so far apart I don't see it really effecting each other. To me it like saying an asteroid that collided with Mars killed the dinosaurs on Earth.

See, though, they may be world's apart but disco drastically shifted the industry's focus. Not saying Disco killed or stole prog's fanbase, but took away it's 'industry appeal'. However, I think Disco did that to pretty much a large portion of music in general.

Unknown Soldier · 08-13-2011, 03:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neapolitan

There is a irony in that "the trend for longer ...songs had died out." because in the 80's disco and dance song became extended. So the "long song" only died for a while then was reborn in another genre in another decade.

I was actually referring to rock genres as a whole here and not disco or dance, if you end up making the parameters too wide, well the whole debate easily loses focus and becomes too general.

The long song was very much the thing for much of the 70s before it died out (in rock circles) and it wasn`t until around the mid 80s to late 80s that a number of non-prog bands started to include some longer material on their albums. It only really started to gain momentum again, with the re-emergence of a number of prog bands in the 90s. Nothing confusing in that, just an example of how trends swing around.

Howard the Duck · 08-13-2011, 05:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unknown Soldier

I was actually referring to rock genres as a whole here and not disco or dance, if you end up making the parameters too wide, well the whole debate easily loses focus and becomes too general.

The long song was very much the thing for much of the 70s before it died out (in rock circles) and it wasn`t until around the mid 80s to late 80s that a number of non-prog bands started to include some longer material on their albums. It only really started to gain momentum again, with the re-emergence of a number of prog bands in the 90s. Nothing confusing in that, just an example of how trends swing around.

neo-prog was already emerging in the mid-80s

Marillion was the most popular group, they were already bringing song cycles and multi-sectioned songs back into fashion then

Unknown Soldier · 08-13-2011, 05:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Il Duce

neo-prog was already emerging in the mid-80s

Marillion was the most popular group, they were already bringing song cycles and multi-sectioned songs back into fashion then

They were one of the few mainstream prog bands to do so. All the others such as Yes, Rush, Camel, Genesis, King Crimson, Jethro Tull, Asia (prog roots) Kansas, Styx etc were putting out in general much more straight forward song compositions in line with current rock trends. Remember AOR ruled the airwaves up until the mid 1980s, in fact the group Magnum who were in essence a prog style band, pretty much broke the trend though along with Marillion and stuck to their guns.

Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra · 08-13-2011, 02:10 PM

Blues is great but massively overemphasized, musics rooted in blues are good, but musics rooted in Slavic folk, Asian, and Indian styles are often more dynamic, and interesting. Even if Jazz has proven you can push the boundaries, non-western musics are ridiculously underrated.

Neapolitan · 08-13-2011, 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unknown Soldier

I was actually referring to rock genres as a whole here and not disco or dance, if you end up making the parameters too wide, well the whole debate easily loses focus and becomes too general.

Maybe I should tighten up my parameters and not be too general when I try for the humourous ... maybe I would get better lulz.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unknown Soldier

The long song was very much the thing for much of the 70s before it died out (in rock circles) and it wasn`t until around the mid 80s to late 80s that a number of non-prog bands started to include some longer material on their albums. It only really started to gain momentum again, with the re-emergence of a number of prog bands in the 90s. Nothing confusing in that, just an example of how trends swing around.

I was I wasn't trying to prove you wrong it was more like yeah you're right about the long song in Rock and did you ever notice that the long song which was criticized in Rock became a staple in disco and dance remix... maybe it's not such a humorous observation after all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra

See, though, they may be world's apart but disco drastically shifted the industry's focus. Not saying Disco killed or stole prog's fanbase, but took away it's 'industry appeal'. However, I think Disco did that to pretty much a large portion of music in general.

There are a couple of examples where certain musical trends and advancements in technology caused changes in the music industry. I could see where that was one of them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Necromancer

That's defiantly an unpopular opinion concerning the scientific study of celestial objects and phenomena.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra

Blues is great but massively overemphasized, musics rooted in blues are good, but music rooted in Slavic folk, Asian, and Indian styles are often more dynamic, and interesting. Even if Jazz has proven you can push the boundaries, non-western musics are ridiculously underrated.

Blues and Jazz are not strictly Western so...it's like a self fulfilling prophesy that you're underrating them. Jazz wouldn't be the Jazz we know today if it wasn't for the fact that it incorporate influences from Slavic, Romani and Jewish music.

Necromancer · 08-13-2011, 09:14 PM

The Music Industry "No Longer Exist".

Trends in the Music Industry 2011 | THE BIZ: Music Business Portal

Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra · 08-13-2011, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neapolitan

Blues and Jazz are not strictly Western so...it's like a self fulfilling prophesy that you're underrating them. Jazz wouldn't be the Jazz we know today if it wasn't for the fact that it incorporate influences from Slavic, Romani and Jewish music.

Jazz is a music that thrives of accumulation and assimilation. It's why it's so broad, and ingenious. It's still very much 'blues based' in the sense it comes from western roots.

08-13-2011, 02:10 PM	#6807 (permalink)
Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra \/ GOD Join Date: May 2010 Location: Nowhere... Posts: 2,179	Blues is great but massively overemphasized, musics rooted in blues are good, but musics rooted in Slavic folk, Asian, and Indian styles are often more dynamic, and interesting. Even if Jazz has proven you can push the boundaries, non-western musics are ridiculously underrated.

08-13-2011, 09:14 PM	#6809 (permalink)
Necromancer Divination Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,655	The Music Industry "No Longer Exist". Trends in the Music Industry 2011 \| THE BIZ: Music Business Portal