Terrapin_Station

First, it's not that progressive rock has some sort of defining song structures. The characteristic is rather than it departs from traditional pop song structures. There are defining structures in traditional pop songs. But there aren't set ways that progressive departs from that. All that's required are intentional departures.

Blank.

Progressive rock is defined by complex music. Not departing from tradition.

Terrapin_Station

So things are correct or incorrect because of intuition and with respect to normal ways of thinking about things? That's what common sense amounts to. Do you have even the faintest idea how I define progressive rock?

Terrapin_Station

There are two problems with that:

(1) There's no clear way to define complexity.

(2) No matter how you attempt to define complexity, there's a bunch of music conventionally considered progressive rock that's not complex per the definition chosen.That's part of how I define it, and it works out well as a demarcation criterion.

Blank.

Allow me to dismantle your definition.

Black Sabbath. The band that is most often credited with creating the entire genre. So, let's listen to one of their songs.



Point out the prog.

JGuy Grungeman

Did you just state a 70's band is responsible for creating a genre that's been around since the late-60's? If anyone, King Crimson made it.

__________________
I'm a pretty nice troll if you ask me.

Blank.

Personally, I don't think you can pinpoint it on one band as creating a genre. Generally there is a slow progression into the genre.

Terrapin_Station

It's not that I'm saying that metal IS progressive rock, by the way. It's that it has progressive rock influences.

Okay, so those influences:

* The song departs from conventional verse/chorus/verse/chorus/bridge/chorus-type structures.

* It's comprised of a number of different sections, almost like a suite of mini-songs, with tempo changes, meter changes, etc.

* The arrangement is very unusual--for example, the way everything but the vocal and hi-hat drop out for the verses.

* It departs from traditional pop song structures harmonically in some very unusual ways. For example, the major second (the (flat) 7th to the root, with the 7th on the downbeat) in the verses, which leads simply to a chromatic walkdown starting at the minor third, with emphasis on the minor second, which functions as a suspension.

I could give you more, but those are just a few quick things.

Blank.

So.... then this song should be called prog then

Track Three

It does away with all conventionalities and writes the music in its own way. This song should be considered prog then. Frown, I can appreciate your stuff now that I know your prog!

Terrapin_Station

I would say that no metal is prog. Rather, it has prog influences. That all metal has prog influences makes the idea of "prog metal" murky. But basically, prog metal is metal with stronger prog influences, or we could just say "metal accepted as having prog influences by the prog community."