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Old 08-01-2008, 03:38 PM   #231 (permalink)
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Awesome, I'll post the #12 in the next hour right after I go buy some drugs.

BTW: Urban I commend your patience dealing with this guy.

Whogivesa.... I hope you keep posting here, it's hard to get a read on people at first, be patient, everyone you're arguing with has proven (IMO) to be fair and level headed, only thing I'd critique you on is being so abrasive, even if provoked it does you (and everyone else) no good.

BE right back.
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Old 08-01-2008, 04:08 PM   #232 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Urban Hatemonger View Post
art pop is a term I confabulated out of my proverbial cobwebs on the spot. It's a term that for me describes more so an effect the artist/band has socially that constitutes a resulting clique mentality. It's a phenomenon that attaches and best lends itself to a commercial popularity drawn form a pseudo intellectual underground which is in reality neither.

Ok, we'll start here. In this particular situation, to confabulate is to attempt to retrieved and assemble a composite whole from fragments of thoughts or memories. Within this context I am referring to a popular music classification. This is NOT genre debate. This is not genre bending. The term "Art Pop" has been used MANY times over the years to describe various bands/artists that feign a supposed uniqueness that sets them apart. Most often in the form of glamor (Bowie/T-Rex) or trend (Radiohead/Beck). These same AP wielders are much more radio marketable via the corporate media's (labels) push. This being as opposed to their esoteric and more so true to personal stringent musically convicted brethren, their peers. The first thing that a marketable quantity must do to survive is to find a market. Labels/Radio work together to create those. Can anyone possibly be gullible enough to think that the song "Creep" received air play based solely in and of it's own merit? I don't think so. That's called the corporate push. So in order for a group to prosper in a truly popular sense, they MUST be marketed by an organization that is potentially capable of insuring their health in a vastly fluctuating market. Radiohead has that behind them. People can blab on till their blue in the face about their Indie status, and how they have been true to themselves, but the truth is, that stopped just as soon as their song got significant air play. They receive incredible amounts of direction and production aid. That's a fact. EVERYONE, save the absolute cheese whiz, gets their start in the Indie music community. It's up to the Corp. scouts to recognize and forward in momentum that individual group's potential as a bread earner for themselves. The rest is just critical wind in sales for which Radiohead has done an awesome job of maintaining a high level of controversial interest. You can thank the marketers for that. This being both from fans (the Radiohead defense clique fanboy base of operations ;-) and from professional critics alike. Meanwhile, a long ways off in dusty dirty basements and halls you have their musical counter parts, the true progressive musicians and artists. Progressive music means specifically to be taken beyond an accepted boundary with respect to musicianship, cultural influence and composite musical make up. Radiohead is none of these whatsoever. They are a pop band. Specifically an Art Pop band. The musical Genre they belong to is Rock. The family of Rock is Alternative. The reason why the species or exact animal is Art Pop is because of their moderate electronic and experimental leanings. No more so mind you, than that which is deemed acceptable by their market. They are therefore centric to their market as opposed to those that are eccentric. The eccentrics are much more so your true Art Rock/Prog Rock classifications. You don't find them touted highly on popular music message boards or the radio, but they are hundreds of times in most cases more talented and UNDER RATED than their brethren from the other side of the tracks. So to speak.

Now, I probably missed the mark of your exacting question, but at least you know that I am sincere.
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Old 08-01-2008, 04:46 PM   #233 (permalink)
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12. The Eminem

Most Overrated Album: The Slim Shady LP
Most Overrated song: Stan

His meteoric rise to the top of the popular music industry began in 1998 as MTV at first tentatively began it's transition into a hip-hop lead style over substance outpost. It all began with the hyper-annoying and (self admitted) gimmick of a sensation "My name is" which was an introduction into the scatter brained at times creative but often angry world of Marshall Mathers. The song mad him a superstar and along with the credibility that comes from being pared with producer Dr. Dre allowed Em to catapult almost instantly to the top of the mainstream hip-hop mountain. The album "The Slim Shady" Lp was hailed as inspired and unique but when revisited already sounds dated and stale.

Following up the success of the album however, the great white homophobe released his seminal number, the undeniably enjoyable and lyrically sensational (for creativity not content) Marshall Mathers LP. Still as his popularity continued to climb, as an artist and performer Eminem left fringe fans cold, with lackluster performances and lyrics that grow old very quickly. The third major release album 2002's Eminem Show, while a major step down was still a well received album and remains a fan favorite of many. And Encore from 2004 despite being garbage was well reviewed also.

So Eminem has a partially deserved impressive resume, so why is he over rated? Because it's undeserved, the lyrics are meaningless and the bombastic nature of his twisted nursery rhyme prose wears on a thoughtful listener very quickly as does his wet noodle personality and narrow minded cynicism. Not to mention for such a phenom and a rising star, he is anything but prolific. As Jay-Z put it when talking about Nas "Four albums in 10 years, I can divide...that's a one hot album every ten year average" Eminem is unquestionable a creation of an MTV culture that has dumbed down popular music especially hip-hop\rap music. For all of these reasons he is the 12th most over rated artist of all-time.
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If you're posting in the music forums make sure to be thoughtful and expressive, if you're posting in the lounge ask yourself "is this something that adds to the conversation?" It's important to remember that a lot of people use each thread. You're probably not as funny or clever as you think, I know I'm not.

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Old 08-01-2008, 05:30 PM   #234 (permalink)
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Ah, well spoken, JayJamJah! I find Eminem ridiculous. His lyrics are base and disgusting, not thought provoking at all. And there's absolutely nothing to the music itself, just simple beats repeated over and over. You're definately right about MTV's culture dumbing down popular music.
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Old 08-01-2008, 05:32 PM   #235 (permalink)
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Ah, well spoken, JayJamJah! I find Eminem ridiculous. His lyrics are base and disgusting, not thought provoking at all. And there's absolutely nothing to the music itself, just simple beats repeated over and over. You're definately right about MTV's culture dumbing down popular music.
i agree woth you to an extent but emiem has had so songs with meaning...but youve probly just heard "my name is" and the one about his "pee-pee" right?
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Old 08-01-2008, 05:35 PM   #236 (permalink)
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i agree woth you to an extent but emiem has had so songs with meaning...but youve probly just heard "my name is" and the one about his "pee-pee" right?
Well, perhaps I was being a little unfair. But after listening to those two songs you just mentioned, I didn't have the patience to explore his musical catalogue any longer.
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Old 08-01-2008, 05:37 PM   #237 (permalink)
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Well, perhaps I was being a little unfair. But after listening to those two songs you just mentioned, I didn't have the patience to explore his musical catalogue any longer.
hahaha i dont really blame you but he does have a couple good ones "cleanin' out my closet" and "stan" are pretty good "guilty conscience" is almost there...but the end of it debases the entire meaning of the song "like toy soldiers" isnt to bad either
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Old 08-01-2008, 05:42 PM   #238 (permalink)
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I've never understood the Coldplay hype. They seem to me like a more pop/radio friendly Radiohead/U2.
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Old 08-01-2008, 05:42 PM   #239 (permalink)
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Eminem has made an absolutely brilliant slice of music in 'Lose Yourself' which lyrically and musically is a perfect example of how damn good the genre can be and also be a pointer as to how and why the genre took formation. Unfortunately 99% of his output was infantile commercial pap.
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Old 08-01-2008, 05:43 PM   #240 (permalink)
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hahaha i dont really blame you but he does have a couple good ones "cleanin' out my closet" and "stan" are pretty good "guilty conscience" is almost there...but the end of it debases the entire meaning of the song "like toy soldiers" isnt to bad either

I guess I'll take your word for it, but to be honest I'm not into the whole hip-hop/rap scene.
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