Jester

1. Jesus Christ. How many times have I said that good lyricism IS part of being a good rapper? I said it's not everything. Go back and respond to my earlier post that you ignored before you feed me this shit, man. Punchlines are like the slam dunks of hip hop, but they need to be used right. Sure, there are times when punchlines can be avoided. There are not strict guidelines within hip hop. That's the fucking beauty of the culture.

2. The right kind of gangsta rap is excellent; punchline rap IS fucking boring. One word: Monochromatism.

3. Like I said, name them. No one focused on spitting as many punchlines as possible before Big L. If I'm wrong, then so be it. How is this so fucking difficult for you to understand? Yes, rappers have pretty much always made use of punchlines. However, Big L was the first one to write verses which consisted of basically all punchlines.

Sparky

The only people i can think who fit your description would be Lil Wayne and all of Young Money, and so i'm inclined to agree with you.

slimfire

Em

Jester

For punchline rap? There's a lot of underground cats that go for it and suck, too. I used to know more, but, like, Chino XL, Vakill, Qwel (sometimes, but he's actually good other times, too). And yeah, most of those Young Money cats go for punchline rap a lot too; Soulja Boy released a track a while ago that was built around nothing but punchlines. It showed that he has potential to be clever (and I hate him just as much as everyone else), but it was a horrible track, anyway.

Captain Awesome

Big Daddy Kane and the entire rap battle scene that existed before Big L and all the battle rappers that came with it.

There, that was easy.



"Punchlines are like the slam dunks of hip hop, but they need to be used right. Sure, there are times when punchlines can be avoided. There are not strict guidelines within hip hop. That's the ****ing beauty of the culture."

Then why are we arguing? It seems to me like we agree. Lyricism is needed but it has to be used right, you have to use it effectively to be a good lyricist you can't just throw together a bunch of assonance rhyming, alliteration, punchlines and multies if it makes no sense (e.g canibus) in a vague attempt to try and be considered "lyrical".


Also considering "punchline rapper" is just a sub-genre you amde up there's a lot of rappers who can fit into it but not all of the time. A lot of rappers to tracks where they do back to back punchlines but they don't do it on every single track (even Big L didn't do it on every single track). I mean jesus by your definition Ludacris is a punchline rapper.

__________________

"If we're all merely players in a play on this great stage,
the problem is the script writers ain't on the same page,
I echo through the mountain when I'm singing in the air,
from my lab a lad with lavish lyrics living in his lair."


"Wake up and listen, hear what's not for the public's ears
Pinocchio poets played by profiting puppeteers"

Jester

Kane's really good with punchlines and all that, and he's very influential with them (amongst other things), but his music was not the manifestation of punchline rap. Battle scenes probably built around one liners a lot, but that's not the same as rapping on records.

Ludacris only has one song built entirely around punchlines. And it's amazing, because it exposes the cheesiness of punchlines but it's still really clever and he's got the right style to pull it off once.

We're only arguing because you rely too much on lyricism. For example: saying Guru is only average at rapping because he's got a relatively basic style. It's a basic style that he pulls off right and makes work, and (like I've said before) he's creative and artistic enough to say things that stick with you. He's good at what he does, man.

Punchline rap is not really a genre, I've said this. You're acting like it's some farfetched concept that I'm pulling out of my ass, when I'm simply describing a particular stylistic trait. "Punchline rap" isn't anything, but you understand what it is. (Well, you should, but apparently you're not.)

No, Big L didn't spit EVERY SINGLE LINE as a one liner. But Christ, a majority (and I mean a huge majority) of his work is built around them.

Captain Awesome

And neither was Big L's.

Then perhaps it's a case of me not liking what he does. I don't know. But what I do know is that lyricism is essential, and without it you can only be so good. But if you abuse it or fail to use it effectively you would be just as well not using it at all.

Actually he has three, but maybe you haven't heard his newest stuff?

__________________

"If we're all merely players in a play on this great stage,
the problem is the script writers ain't on the same page,
I echo through the mountain when I'm singing in the air,
from my lab a lad with lavish lyrics living in his lair."


"Wake up and listen, hear what's not for the public's ears
Pinocchio poets played by profiting puppeteers"

Jester

No one employed as many punchlines into their lyrics as Big L before Big L. Kane probably came closest, but he didn't do it enough to the point where he was basically recognized for punchlines. Big L is pretty much recognized by critics for his cleverness and heavy use of punchlines.

I can agree with this.

Battle of the Sexes or Luda Living? Let me know what they are, I guess.

Even if he has three now, it's not enough to make him (stylistically) a rapper who goes for one liners like 3/4 of the time. "Hip Hop Quotables" is the best punchline laced track ever, probably. Big L's tracks are more thoughtful, but Luda's accomplishes more. Don't know why I'm saying this, but whatever. We can discuss anything.

P A N

Wesley willis all the way!!!

anticipation

MF DOOM: Everything pre-Born Like This, (excluding Venemous Villain), is top quality. Lyricism, beatmaking, punchlines, hooks, eccentricity and subject-matter are all mastered and showcased through DOOM's music. Seemingly effortless flow coupled with extensive pop culture and underground scene societal references come together to form one of the strongest catalogs in hip hop history.