The Official Religious/Political Debate Thread (country, single, American, African)

[Eltiraaz]

Bush doesnt think, his underlings do that for him.

I think before the world goes anyfurther with ANYTHING. We should make sure that everyone is living a good environment, is fed, is educated, has rights, is healthy, etc.

I mean we have enought problems as it is. Why do we have to f*ck things up even more...constantly..

[IamAlejo]

The cost of freedom. It seems to have increased with technology. We use the smart bombs to try to keep them away from civilians, but maybe we could have saved a few bucks and just nuked all of Iraq?

I think before the world goes anyfurther with ANYTHING. We should make sure that everyone is living a good environment, is fed, is educated, has rights, is healthy, etc.

Whoa whoa whoa, right now, if you have the desire to become educated in the US, you can become educated. It's a matter of will. I'm not saying our schools are great, nor do they force feed us information, but if you want to be educated you can. Most everyone has rights, unless you are a convicted felon, etc. Healthy? Bush did a medicare overhaul costing $200 million which many people complained costed too much. Make sure everyone is fed, hell, why doesn't Bush just wipe their ass. People don't work during college, high school, and then expect for everything to be done for them.

[Sharky]

Hmm.

Would it be fair to say, that maybe if the war in Iraq had achieved more with the money it costed, than it would if the money was spent on say, AIDs research, then it would be justified?

I really don't know what to think about this, except that maybe, just maybe, there was a cheaper, less violent way to solve the problems in that country.

EDIT: Christ, as of me posting the cost is now $116,509,529,308. That's almost 400 million dollars between this post and the first...

[IamAlejo]

Please, money is being spent on research. But Congress and President Bush both believe that the war on Iraq is important enough to be spending this kind of money on the war. These are the people we voted into office, whether it be the President or your Congressmen, and if you didn't vote, it now gives you a reason to.

[jibber]

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

The cost of freedom. It seems to have increased with technology. We use the smart bombs to try to keep them away from civilians, but maybe we could have saved a few bucks and just nuked all of Iraq?



Whoa whoa whoa, right now, if you have the desire to become educated in the US, you can become educated. It's a matter of will. I'm not saying our schools are great, nor do they force feed us information, but if you want to be educated you can. Most everyone has rights, unless you are a convicted felon, etc. Healthy? Bush did a medicare overhaul costing $200 million which many people complained costed too much. Make sure everyone is fed, hell, why doesn't Bush just wipe their ass. People don't work during college, high school, and then expect for everything to be done for them.

so naiive...
not everyone has the chance to get a good education, even in the US. High school, ya i'll agree with you there. but so many people drop out becasue they're needed at home, or they can't live at home, so they're forced to leave, live on the streets, shelters, wherever they can. Even if you are lucky enough to be born into a fimly who has the means to send you to a decent high school, and actually support you through those years, what then? it's hard to get a good job nowadays without a degree of some sort, be it university, technical college, whatever. but that's simply not possible for a lot of people. the fact of the matter is, education costs money, and there's still hundreds of thousdands of people who don't have the means or the opportunities to make something happen for themselves. Thinking that all you need to be successful is determination and a good work ethic is incredibly naiive, not to mention pretty ignorant.

[Sharky]

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Please, money is being spent on research. But Congress and President Bush both believe that the war on Iraq is important enough to be spending this kind of money on the war. These are the people we voted into office, whether it be the President or your Congressmen, and if you didn't vote, it now gives you a reason to.

LOL you completely changed what you said. So I'm going to quote what you originally posted.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Please, money is being spent on research. I'd personally LOVE to see who is in charge of that site and where they get the information from.

LOL again! You do amuse me sir. Clearly you neglected to notice the rather obvious section of the site that boldly explains where they got their information from - then you saw it, realised how much of a twat you look, and changed your post COMPLETELY.

I don't mean to sound rude, but someone who can make that sort of mistake isn't going to be someone I'll take voting advice from.

Also, I am fully aware that money is being spent on research. Just not enough - my point was that if they spent that money on research, even MORE could be done.

[SOTYrocks!]

ok heres what i think. we as americans should stick george dubua bush out in irag just so he can see what he is doing to our family and friends. i hope kerry wins the election. this is so reddiculous.

[Sharky]

Originally Posted by SOTYrocks!

ok heres what i think. we as americans should stick george dubua bush out in irag just so he can see what he is doing to our family and friends. i hope kerry wins the election. this is so reddiculous.

Or alternatively, how about we just overthrow GWB and end the war in "irag"?

(LOL sorry, I just had to do it)

Just imagine all the neat stuff that we'd be able to do with the money... (You could start with getting me a new computer! This thing bites.)

[IamAlejo]

Hmmm...What has Kerry done that has gotten you so confident in him? I changed my post (that's why I edited it...durr) because I went to the site because I am willing to do research based on sites/info you guys put up. That countdown is set on a set total
Congress made and is set to reach that total on a certain date. But one thing I was wondering, which was not in their information, is that is that money additional to our normal military spendings on bombs, ship repairs, etc. Because I do believe it is. And Jibber, living in the United States, whether you are financially able or not, if you have the drive to get an education, you CAN get an education. Opportunities are available, night school, etc. Student loan systems.

but so many people drop out becasue they're needed at home, or they can't live at home, so they're forced to leave, live on the streets, shelters, wherever they can

When people are needed at home, they don't have the time to get an education. How is that the government's problem? Maybe they should just go and pay the parents who a)probably didn't try to get an education when they were younger or b) are too lazy to get a job.

How do you think those shelters are paid for? Miracles? No, the government strikes again. People take so many things for granted, this government provides everything. Yet they complain.


All in all...I'm tired of hearing people complain about our president who was elected by our people to run office. If you have a problem, go out and vote, be the voice of america. It's a beautiful thing. People want money spent on research, money spent on this, and money spent on that. I'd love to see the taxes you people pay. Probably jack****. I don't pay much, but then again, I don't complain about how tax dollars get spent. Until Bill Gates starts demanding he wants research done on African Monkeys for AIDS, I am fine with how the money is being spent. And if you are not, shut the **** up, go out to the polls, and do something about it when November rolls around.

[Sharky]

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Hmmm...What has Kerry done that has gotten you so confident in him?

It's not what he's done, it's what he hasn't done that bush has, and what he doesn't like about bush that we don't like. We feel solidarity with the guy because he considers Bush to be a total moron. Opportunism or not, he's the only person to support.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

I changed my post (that's why I edited it...durr) because I went to the site because I am willing to do research based on sites/info you guys put up.

You changed your post because you realised that you're a dumb **** that doesn't do his research before he opens his big wide mouth.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

That countdown is set on a set total
Congress made and is set to reach that total on a certain date.

So in other words, it's based on estimates for the end cost, and is counting up to that end cost. Either the end of this war is very near, or the end cost will be absolutely huge.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

But one thing I was wondering, which was not in their information, is that is that money additional to our normal military spendings on bombs, ship repairs, etc. Because I do believe it is.

It's the entire cost of war. Bombs, ships, tanks, missles, ammo, men, food, diesel, water, aviation fuel, uranium rods, grenades, clothing, armor, nightvision, power generators, trucks, maintenance, explosives, etc. etc. etc.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

And Jibber, living in the United States, whether you are financially able or not, if you have the drive to get an education, you CAN get an education. Opportunities are available, night school, etc. Student loan systems.

So what you're telling me is that, you can get an education no matter who you are? Bull****. Schools can turn you down, you may be unable to move to go to try other areas for their schools, you might be unable to pay off the student loans... and so on.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

When people are needed at home, they don't have the time to get an education. How is that the government's problem? Maybe they should just go and pay the parents who a)probably didn't try to get an education when they were younger or b) are too lazy to get a job.

I don't see what's wrong with the government giving money to parents that cannot leave home to go to work but need the money to support themselves. It's known as childcare benefits and it's already in existance.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

How do you think those shelters are paid for? Miracles? No, the government strikes again. People take so many things for granted, this government provides everything. Yet they complain.

The majority of the homeless shelters are run, payed for, and owned by completely independant charity organisations. I've LIVED IN ONE before, and anyone else who has ever had to use one will tell you that there isn't enough government funding going into these charities.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

All in all...I'm tired of hearing people complain about our president who was elected by our people to run office.

You may be tired of hearing it, but it doesn't make the complaining wrong. As a US citizen, or member of the human race, you have every right to complain about a world leader.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

If you have a problem, go out and vote, be the voice of america. It's a beautiful thing.

The majority of us here probably aren't even old enough to vote. I'm not. But I will when I am old enough.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

People want money spent on research, money spent on this, and money spent on that.

Yes because there is not enough being spent on it. They could do the job they need to if more money was put into it, and this is what people do not realise. Simply pumping some random figure into a goverment sector or independant research foundation is not good enough, the goverment need to meet their demands for funding.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

I'd love to see the taxes you people pay. Probably jack****.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the taxes are based on how well off you are - so that the poor don't pay as much in taxes as the wealthy. So what you are actually insinuating here (intended or not) is that we're probably poor.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

I don't pay much, but then again, I don't complain about how tax dollars get spent.

LOL. Well I don't see what the problem is with complaining about how the government is spending YOUR money. It's not like we're whinging about what brand of cigarrette George Dubya smokes.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

Until Bill Gates starts demanding he wants research done on African Monkeys for AIDS, I am fine with how the money is being spent.

OK. Well we're not.

Originally Posted by IamAlejo

And if you are not, shut the **** up, go out to the polls, and do something about it when November rolls around.

We are doing things about it. We become members of charities, we donate money, we petition the goverment for more funding. And those of us that care enough about things use our vote to support the things that we care about. But I do not see the sense in just shutting the hell up between here and november. Voting is not the zenith of political problem solving.