You want to come off a little bit like an arsehole that's one of the points but okay I will give you an example of a neg I threw this girl. Sure it was just on facebook but I would have done the same thing had I seen her irl. I just didn't like her outfit lol.

I think picking apart their outfit/shoes is the nicest and easiest neg to pull off and it may even spark conversation about what men think looks good on girls vs what they spend all that time getting ready for and still look like a hot mess.
The whole judging of the outfit and using it as a neg varies from girl to girl obviously. If see a girl looks like she's very proud of what she is wearing or looks a little overdressed for the place that she's attending let her have it.

Okay back to my example I went off on a tangent.

This girl posted a picture of this outfit that she was so proud of and guys were leaving her a bunch of meaningless empty compliments. So , I decided to go against the flow of all that "smoke blowing up her butt". I told her "your outfit is okay but that belt you have around your waist is a bit much and throws off the whole outfit." Well this neg didn't work on her as I'm guess negs don't really work as well online. It was my first time trying it out online for experimental purposes. Anyways, I noticed someone commented on her pic the other day and I went through looking for my comment to see if she responded and all she did was delete the negative comment which wasn't even that by it was just my opinion of her "perfect" outfit. :rofl:

Okay I promised to jot down some of the lingo that I will be using and explain it before hand so when I get to the techniques part you won't be as lost.

Avatar - creating an avatar is something that is simple. The point of an avatar is to go give yourself a makeover essentially. You want to get a few clothes that make you stand out in the sea of buttoned up shirts that the majority of guys wear at clubs.
(personally I don't agree too much with avatars, like wear whatever the f you want just as long as you are clean and comfortable. The only part of creating an avatar that I agree with is having some slight thing that stands out on you, that you could use as a conversation starter. For example, this is very simple but you can't believe how effective it is. Since i'm obessed with my shades, I would wear my night shades out when I go to clubs. Of course , most women laughed and thought I was an idiot for wearing shades at night but when the few that asked me why I was wearing them while giggling at me. I had this line prepared ahead of time "I have to wear my shades at night because my future is so bright. Would you care to take a glimpse into my future? if they said yes then that's how the conversation would start out about what's going on in my life and I would find out what they are doing with their life as well.)

Set - this is just the term for a group. The group can consist of all females or a mixed group of females and males. or it can be all males if you are into that and are in that kind of club.

Field - This term means anywhere you go to practice and hone your skills. The most common field is a bar/club but the field can be a simple place like a mall or local library as well.

Target - I will mention this quite often, it just refers to a woman/man that you have set your sights on getting to know better.

Wingman - I'm fairly sure most of you know what this means but I will explain in detail anyways. A wingman is anyone that helps you to look better in the eyes of your target. They also do various other jobs. They can block out alpha females for you in a set. They can protect you from grenades. They can also go out and scout the target for you to initiate the conversation if you are a bit too shy to start it up yourself. They play off of your best qualities.

Grenade - I had a different term for this but ever since Jersey Shore, I like it so I use it more often now. When I use the term grenade, I don't mean it in the same way they do. They use it in a horrible way to claim that a girl is ugly. The way I use it is somewhat similar but I wouldn't say the girl is ugly. The girl is just not high on your lists of things that you look for in a girl. For example, Dirty has a friend that loves bigger women. In his books, a slim cheerleader type girl would be a grenade because that's not what he prefers in his women.

(I will edit this list and add more later on)

Thats to funny. I wonder how much that actually happens, aka how many bad things are deleted in a day. Its sad that someone cant take a small remark like that.

I have a question for the guys out there

What is your stance on dating a woman that has a kid/kids?

Im doing that right now. I dont like kids so guess we are not gona last to long! Good times in the meantime though. Her fault, shouldnt be 22 with a 1 year old. Call me an arsehole but seriously WWJD!

:rofl: I had to deal with a 19 year old girl that had a 1 year old.

I think I found the secret to dating a woman that has kids.

Enjoy it while it lasts and remember you are dating the woman and she doesn't want you in her life to take care of the kid so it shouldn't be that big of a deal.

Unless you can clearly tell that is her intentions is to find a daddy for the kid or a baby daddy for that matter to help her pay for the child's expenses then I would run in the complete opposite direction.

I find it amazing that people used to have kids at that age ALL THE TIME not so many years ago. I mean the lifespan of a human was barely that much lower. I cant imagine feeling obligated to have a kid because of social standards in my late teens early twenties.

yeah it seems pretty rough to have your life tied down so early and have that big of a responsibility.

I'm going to do a pretty big write up for this thread later on tonight discussing how to open various sets.

Okay so this write up isn't as big as I thought it was going to be because opening sets isn't that difficult.

The idea behind opening a set successful is to go up to the group and while you are talking to them find the most charismatic person in the group and engage them. They will probably be the alpha person of the group controlling much of the conversation. If you are able to win of this person then you are in like flin.

Normally it is a good idea to pre-game ahead of time if you are prone to shyness and come up with some good conversation starters while you are at home.

Like Dirty mentioned earlier, it's nice to come up with someone that's situational but almost universal. My friend is having girl problems what should he do about such and such or what is your opinion on such topic. Or how do you feel about a certain topic.

Whatever you do, your conversation starter should be an opinion type question. If it's a yes/no question then the conversation isn't going to go much further than their response.

dj, I couldn't help but notice when reading through this thread that you often seem to favour a very... openly aggressive stance when it comes to confrontations. Like, in the whiskey situation, your hindsight response was to rip into the guy (in his own store, where he probably had the upper ground in any confrontation) and basically make a battle of it. The was another situation in thre thread where you talked about a similar situation where you would have eaten the guy's face off had you thought about it at the time (I can't remember the exact details, but the response was the same). I'm just wondering, are you of the opinion that this is the best thing to do, if you want to impress a girl watching the whole thing?

I don't mean to undermine you or anything, but where I'm from, blowing up because of a nasty comment is a sign of insecurity, which would be picked up on instantly by any girl. The fact that you would react so aggressively to the comment just shows that the other guy managed to hit you where it hurts. In my society, it's better to either roll with it and make a joke out of it (and make the girl laugh), or make a calm, slightly stabbing rebuttal implying that they have no clue what they're on about (Implying that you are totally unfazed by their meagre attempt to put you down). The instant you react aggressively is the instant you lose.

For example, I would ascribe much more to boozin's approach to the situation: basically ignoring his attempts to clear you out like he's not there, maybe keep asking him and the girl questions while you wander around the shop to frustrate him. Obviously, he wants to chat up the girl, and there's no way you're gonna manage it while he's there (indefinitely :P) so you may as well screw his chances even more, and hell, if you're funny enough in the process, you might get the girl on your side against him (especially if he reacts aggressively to your calm conversation). However, if you started going on about how he needed to take his cialis... it allows him to protray you as the bad guy, the stuck up young one trash talking him in his own store. If he's in any way experienced (which he probably is, owning a liquor store), he'd shut down that sort of approach in no time, just making you look like an idiot.

In other words: as soon as you accept his challenge, you put him on equal footing with you. You don't know how good he's gonna be at putting you down, and he's on his home turf with a much greater "piss off and leave" advantage than you have. The only way you can end the confrontation is by acceding to his demands that you leave, so as soon as you start it, all he has to do is stand his ground and eventually he'll come out looking better. But if you ignore his attempts to set up the fight, you can shoot him down without offering him a chance to level the playing field.

However, this could just be a difference between our societies. How would that go down where you're from? I guess it's all too possible that our cultures are just that different.

That was very well said and I should try that approach as opposed to the way I was thinking about putting him down but the girl in the store would have admired my tact regardless because she seemed like the type that liked aggressive guys that are confident and stand their ground even if they are losing the battle.

The "cialis" comment would have been made as a joke in an attempt to get the girl to laugh. It would all boil down to how I deliver my insults. There are different ways I could have handled the situation like you said and of course it depends on the girl that I'm trying to impress would make me change up my strategy on how to handle it. There is a lot of room for error but it's best to play it by ear and wing it.

I wasn't even there to really hit on the girl though or try to get a date with her or anything. I just took the opportunity that she came into the store to playfully flirt with her.

Hm. Interesting. I understand that you were just flirting, btw - I've only spent two months of the last 5 years single (two serious relationships) but in the current one, we live in different countries and also have the same attitude towards flirting, so it's allowed within the relationship so long as it's always playful :P We're both fairly big flirts, so we figured so long as we're in control and it stops before anyone gets any ideas, it's harmless!

Also understanding the cialis remark being a joke, however it'd be close enough to a jab defined as "Well Harsh" over here, basically meaning that you've overstepped the boundaries of a joke and that the subject of the jab is justified in taking the offended "and what exactly do you mean by that?" approach, and making you out to be the bad guy in the situation. Especially if he was only in his 50s, chances are he has plenty of life left, and would have shrugged something like that off like nothing :P

However, I guess a lot of it comes down to having a style that suits your physical attributes and personality. I'm not a big guy: I have an athletic shape, but it's a lean one, and I'm far better at talking than I am at fighting! So for me, the best approach is to play to my advantage and keep the whole thing purely verbal. If I'm calm, controlled, and good natured, I can blow off anyone acting aggressive as going over the top and overreacting, and I can beat anyone playing the same game. Taking an aggressive stance means, while it may not lead to actualy physical blows, physical posturing is certainly more important, and a bigger guy would always win against me in a looming competition, or even just in looking more aggressive, and if I went aggressive and someone undercut me in the way I normally would react, I'd be caught effectively high and dry.

If he got offended by my remark , I would clearly state that I'm joking an apologize right on the spot. She would have to respect me for owning up to my poor joke if he got offended.

I haven't really been in a serious fight all of my life. I'm a very smooth talker and usually talk my way out of situations even though I don't use the best tactics all the time. I do tend to joke a lot but I also know how to defuse a situation if I see it going down the wrong road. I'm a short stocky guy like I could be a linebacker or something but I don't know how I would fare in a fight. I know some judo but I haven't had a sparring partner in years so I may be rusty. Plus if it did turn into something physical. I wouldn't even try to win that fight if I was trying to impress the girl.

Some girls would rather you not be violent/show violent tendencies so I would lose on purpose. When I come out of it wounded/beaten up a bit. She will come to my aid and help me up and we will walk away from the situation. I will turn around and wink at the loser that beat me up because I'm leaving with the girl and he didn't see what happened.

Of course there are some girls that are on the other side of the spectrum and get turned on by a guy that can defend himself. They feel like if he can defend himself then he can defend me if something goes down and it turns into an issue of you being her protector and she gets turned on by that.

In my experience, every girl likes a guy who can defend himself, it's just that a lot of girls dislike a guy who abuses superior strength. So if you're going fists first into confrontations all the time, you'll probably be ignored by them, but if you win a fight in which you have clearly stated that you don't want to fight it, and without overly hurting the guy, then you'll probably benefit :P

As you said, there are millions of different ways to flirt, or get the girl, or whatever. A lot of those comments are directly aimed at you, I just thought I'd but my opinion out there seeing as it's likely to be at least slightly different. :)

Sometimes, if you ignore the person who insults you, its like sending a message back to them saying 'You aren't even worth my time getting worked up about this' and also shows that you are a lot more confident and comfortable with yourself than if you let his comments get to you.

yeah, but also when you ignore them sometimes they think oh it's okay he doesn't really care so they will keep doing it and doing it to try to get under your skin and one day you'll have to put your foot down. That's how bullies work actually.


I'm going to put my money where my mouth is and become a PUA for the spring/summer. I'm not doing it for all the sex and possible gfs that I can get. I have all of this knowledge and I want to put it to work and conduct some social experiments.

My two wingmen will be helping me out. I have a friend named Trap and another one named Shield. So if I mention either one of those two names you know who I'm talking about.

I went to the mall with Trap two days ago and when we were leaving I came up with this idea for my first social experiment. I want to test out the whole myth about girls liking bad boys. They claim to want a nice guy but when they get one they are bored with him and disregard him. Or they really don't want a nice guy because he isn't exciting enough/doesn't create drama.

When I make these statements they are just generalizations and I KNOW they don't apply to all women. I'm testing this theory on a purely anecdotal platform.

Social Experiment # 1

The way this is going to work is that we are going to go to the mall. I'm going to pick three targets for Trap and he's going to do the same for me. We will try to spit our best negs without going over the line. Well I am. I think Trap is more radical in his thinking and he wants to try something different for a change. He's really going to push the limits of negs. He wants to get slapped pretty much. If he doesn't get slapped then it wasn't a successful test for him. I personally am not going to go that far. :laughing:
So we are going to test out saying a neg and seeing the results/reactions we get. I study body language quite often so I will be looking for those signs while Trap is more into micro expressions of the face. I'm trying to teach him to also look at body signals as well.

I will post back in this thread when I return from the field and let you guys know the results.

I think perhaps you're going at this "bad guy" approach from the wrong angle...

From numerous conversations with girls about this, "bad guys" are (generally) more attractive for a number of reasons:

1) They're not an easy catch. They require effort to get their attention, you can't walk all over them, and they won't always do everything you want (In fact most of the time they'll do what they want and not what you want, but that leads me to the next bit).

2) They're generally a LOT more confident than "nice" guys, and will take command of situations. They're controlling, they offer a feeling of strong, dominant protection.

3) They're frustratingly Unknown. :P The stereotypical nice guy will open his heart and mind to a girl if she just asks. For a bad guy, it takes a lot more to get under their skin. Not knowing what's underneath is one of the greatest allures. Curiosity killed the cat after all :P

However, nowhere in there does it say "insult the hell out of them and see how they respond". If you're intent on trying this, be aloof, be difficult, be uncaring, but don't be insulting. That will just get you slapped, and unless you already have a ridiculous amount of charm, you're not gonna be able to pull that one off.

One final thing to note is that if you are trying to be anything but yourself, it will be noticeable, on some level. If you're inherently a nice guy, and you're trying to pull off a "bad guy" approach, I'd be willing to bet it's gonna fall through almost entirely. Going against your character never works as well as just being yourself, even if you're just trying to get laid :P

I did leave out part but the whole throwing the neg thing is just a light insult and then I'm going to walk away.

I know the main thing about "bad boys" is that they clearly ignore the girls that like/chase them but I wanted to try throwing out a neg and then walking away. I'm not sure if it will have the desired results i'm looking for but I'm going to try it anyways.

Or maybe We could flirt with a one liner then completely walk away. Not even finish up/follow through with bothering to get their number. Also as I said earlier. I'm not doing this to get laid. I want to see reactions.

Confident guys pull it off all the time. They pretend to be someone completely different than they are and say that have professions/jobs that they don't even have and get laid with those lies.

Also another thing, part of the whole bad boy image is being an asshole. If you treat some women badly and be an asshole to them they love you more and you can't avoid them so I'm also testing that theory/myth out as well. Assholes that are cocky/confident tend to get all the women while being a douche bag.

MoonlitSunshine knows his shit,I approve
:bowdown:

[2]

Be warned, I knew this one girl who had a child and ended up on the prowl not too long afterwards trying to find an even cuter set of genes for child number 2.

I'd just like to point out thats definitely worst case scenario haha

That is such a common thing eh, stupid girls get pregnant then go back out to the clubs once the kids born. Great parenting skills.

are you speaking from experience? :yikes:

I was reading advice online from Neil Strauss on openers. Shoulda read that article sooner. Last few weeks I've been meeting a lot of girls, getting a lot of numbers, and hooking up with a solid amount of girls. I have no problem talking to girls, I have a problem starting a conversation. Cause it feels so dumb to just introduce myself and give them a handshake. I don't know why, it just feels like they've probably had that happen 10 times already or something. So I've been just getting drunk, sitting my ass down at the bar and waiting for females to sit on either side of me. Then wait awhile and then ask "me and my friends have been arguing for a few days now, who lies more... men or women." So it's a question they are likely to go into detail about and of course they usually say men lie more. Then I say "really? see i think guys tell small lies like 'your ass looks great in that dress' and girls tell big lies like 'the kid isn't yours" Then the mood is loose and relaxed and and it's all good from there. Sometimes I'll also ask who is more flirty: men or women.

*shrug* all things good so far.

No, Dirty is doing it right. If you want to start up a conversation. When you are trying to engage in some small talk it is always best to ask opinion type questions. if you ask a yes or no question that's all you get is a yes or no and then it becomes awkward as you scramble to find something to talk about.

Battle of the sex type questions are great to ask. I like to ask this simple one. it is similar to the lie one but it works just as well. I'm trying to figure how who cheats more women or men and of course they are going to go in a super wild rant about how men are dogs and cheat more but then I mention that women cheat as well and they are just slightly better at it. The way that some women cheat they usually have a back up to their back up plans so they can cover themselves way better. Men usually don't and that's how they end up getting caught so much.

I'm not super attractive so I'm not gonna wow anybody with my looks right off the bat, so I figure I gotta get the conversation just flowing somehow. Get us both in a comfort zone when we are talking. I've straight up introduced myself but then it seems like it inevitable becomes "Hey, my names Dirty" *handshake or something* "Hi, my name is cute brunette girl" "What do you do, what school do you go to, etc" Same old questions that never seems to go anywhere. I mean I don't like immediately ask them, I usually just sit at the bar like 3-5 minutes while she talks to friends or whoever, act casual, then kinda lean in and pose the question. And if it's a short answer, go into another battle of the sexes question. And if she says girls lie/flirt more, then i playfully argue for the mens side. A girl this past weekend said girls lie more, then I act more surprised than what I actually am and playfully accuse her of being a liar.

Put myself in a bad situation this past weekend. Was in Pittsburgh with friends for a few nights. They went to the upstairs portion of the bar, I went downstairs to talk to some girls. I was pretty hammered and stoned but I was coherent. Beer goggles were being worn. This girl sat next to me and we started talking, hit it off, and like 10 minutes into the conversation she stood up and it was actually a beached whale. :nono: We talked awhile after and she was funny and nice but she was only good from the face up. One of those girls you look at and you're like... Damn she'd be pretty hott if she just lost some weight.

An interesting conversation is also a great way to find out what a person is like, cause someone who is thinking about something is paying less attention to their mannerisms. All the old things aobut mimicking your movements, idly playing with hair, smiling and getting involved in a conversation are signs that a girl is actually interested in talking to you, which is half the battle :P

the more interesting you seem, the more likely you are to get somewhere.

Well if that works for you then okay but the whole winking/smiling...trying to get a girl's attention from across the room and hoping that she will come over to you thing. Never worked for me. Where is it that you go from there? What do you use as your small talk topics?

That's the point where conversation comes into play and I use those "battle of the sex" questions to strike up a conversation.

The whole "who's she with? where's she from? what she does?" just seems boring like it's something every guy in the place does.

there seems to be three types

ones that use a cheesy pickup line to break the ice and attempt some sort of humor.

The ones like you that stick to the whole I'm confident and I will just go up introduce myself and go over the same old same old chit chat type questions. What do you do for a living? Where you are from? etc."

Then there are the types that have unique type questions that bring about more interesting conversations.

Each one has it's own merits and they tend to work for certain people so that's fine but it's just an observation that I have made.

"You think we lie more? Naahh, definitely not! So where're you from anyway? Oh yeah? I don't think I've met anyone from there before! Hmm, where am I from? The Moon."

Just like you said about easily turning those "boring" questions into something interesting the same thing can be said for the bolded part it all falls down to the individual and how confident they are and their conversation skills so basically we are both saying the same thing just with different approaches.

Single guys wish they could find a girl to marry and be with forever.

Married guys wish they were single and had never met the b*tch

People just want what they can't have.

I dont think that really always true. If a guys married he may want that hot single broad, which he could technically go get, but at the end of the day he likes having 1 woman.

I'd say it all depends really, if he marries the hottest single broad he wouldn't wanna look anywhere else for any others.

I just mean he may look. For instance if im with a great looking girlfriend I still looking at other women and imagine. That doesnt mean I want to jump up and get with them.

I'm going out to the bars Friday with a group of girls I've become friends with. They have a friend who isn't quite 21 who I have a thing for. I'm hoping she's pregaming with us Friday so I can flirt with her and get to know her better. But I don't usually go out with a group of girls, I don't have too many female friends anymore. Burned a lot of bridges over the years. I'm interested to see if this has any effect on meeting girls at the bar. I also plan to go out Saturday night and find some girls. I'll report back on my findings.

Good luck Dirty.

I have a question for whomever wants to answer. My biggest problem with new girls Im meeting taking out/going on date with and such is I never know how fast they want to move. Obviously being a guy I dont mind moving real quickly and theres definitely a small portion of girls that do as well. (usually they make it quite obvious) The rest though confuse me, as I have dated one that took over a month and others that I would suggest it within a couple days of meeting/going out with them and get no clear answer.

Now I am not really shy, Ill try mostly anyhting with anyone I please, but I take care in this because as any guy knows some girls that are pushed to fast think your just a pig.

Whats funny to me is that just because I want to have sex/hookup with you doesn't mean I dont actually like you. I cant help that Im a 20 year old male with a strong libido.

It definitly helps to have girls with you when you go out, I've noticed other girls tend to feel more confortable/relaxed if they see them with you, makes you seem more trustworthy. I've never been out with a whole group of girls but meh same principle I reckon.

lol I don't think there was an actual question there but I get what you're getting at. Just don't overthink too much man. If you're feeling it, make an advance, you know; "arm around the chair at the cinema" and all that, just flirt with her and let it progress naturally, you'll make a move, she'll make a move back etc.

like a horny game of chess. man I miss horny chess I need to get out more. I always get checkmated in the first 3 moves but damn it's a fun game. it's like my brother's friend always used to say "It's all about the chase mate "

Sluts are so simple. You both know exactly what the other wants.

Just go out with sluts then if you dig that, you don't have to wanna marry every chick you meet