The Science
 

In this thread, I will discuss different techniques and give dating advice to you hopeless beta males out there.

We just want to help raise your confidence a bit and give you a few pointers. All advice that we give you it completely up to you whether you take it or not.

Remember we have your best interests in mind and don't want to see you getting walked all over by females that don't respect your worth as a person.


This song was in my head when I made the thread.
The song is more about passing on the knowledge of hip hop with some other wisdom but in this thread we will be passing on our knowledge of women.

Oh...my...god...this is going to be interesting. Lesson one screw them over before they can screw you over and your gold. Never turn your back on a friend for a woman...that really burns them up. And always...always...make alcohol more of a priority than them and you cant go wrong. Am I missing anything?

omfg it's funny that you mentioned this.

Today my friend was telling me a story, a friend of his told him that his gf doesn't want him hanging out with him anymore.

So they were walking to his gf's place and the dude is so whipped he starts telling my friend to go hide in the bushes because he doesn't want his gf to see that he is still hanging out with him.

So my friend grew some balls finally and cursed him out for being whipped and choosing her over him. He said he's done with that guy and when he sees him in the hallways or on the street he is going to completely ignore him.

Just beat your bitch and all is well and swell.

until she realizes that she is being abused and calls the cops on you. have fun posting on forums from jail :P

Tell her yeah, you can call the cops, but have fun running when my ass gets out of jail.

JUST KIDDING FELLAS. WOMEN USE NOT ABUSE.

I know you are joking but bleh....women abuse isn't a good topic to be joking about.

There are some women out there stuck in abusive relationships right now because they can't wake up and see that they are being abused.

Yeah you're right those went a little too far.

lol at you and Dirty giving us "beta males" advice even though you're both single.

You do realize many people chose to be single. Just cause someone doesnt always have a partner hanging around there every move doesnt mean they couldnt if they wanted to.

Good thread dj master c.

I can't speak for Dirty but I choose to be single. I have went through some rocky relationships in the past and I want a break for a little bit. I still like to flirt and hit on women though. I choose to be single. It's not like we are giving relationship advice. We are giving advice on how to approach women confidently and to analyze different situations that happens to us.

It is sort of like a science and you have to go through trial and error tests.

I will give you an example.

Yesterday, I went into this liquor store. I was talking to the owner because I wasn't sure what type of whiskey I wanted to buy for friday night. He starts out by joking about why am I coming in asking for types of whiskey when I don't know what I want. He also said some bull**** about if you don't know what you want then you shouldn't be drinking with the big boys don't start now. This store owner looks to be about in his 50s.

A cute girl comes in and he asks her what she wants. She says that she's not sure yet and she's still looking. Does he give her a hard time like me? hell no. He flirts with her and uses to classic line about let me see your ID because you look like you could be about 15 or so and it better not be a fake ID. The lady pulls out her ID and dude snatches it from here and starts being all nosey. Asking here if she's from out of town because she has an Illinois ID. And asking if she knows some dude with her same last name. It turns out she was married to the guy he was asking her about but they got divorced or separated. She decides what she wants so he has to walk around to the back of the counter to get it. I start flirting with her and asking what would she suggest I get. She suggest Bacardi but I'm telling myself that's not really a whiskey so I disregard her advice instantly in my head. The guy comes back to the counter and he sees that i'm flirting with her and making her smile a bit so he tells me. Well since you don't know what you want come back friday when you have money and we will get you something. He was basically kicking me out of his store so he could make to the chick. She's 28 and he's 50 something. As I was leaving I told him..what the hell? you act like i'm trying to cockblock you or something then I walk away. I was pissed as hell on my way back home. As I was leaving I also noticed the chick looked down at my shoes. I'm about to feed into a stereotype but I don't care. Black women tend to look at guy's shoes first before checking out the rest of their outfit when they like a guy. You have to come correct and dress properly if you want to flirt with a black female.

I wasn't pissed that he took the girl I was talking to, I was pissed on the principle alone that he cockblocked me in a sense. He belittled me in front of her and that's mad disrepectful. When I was almost home I was kicking myself for not standing my ground and putting his old pimp ass on blast. He was pretty smooth and I respect his game. I don't respect how he was treating me. He was mad rude and out of place from jump. When I got home, I should've burned him up about how old he is and if he needs to refill his cialis prescription and tell him that if he doesn't want my money I can take my business elsewhere friday. Which is exactly what i'm going to do. I'm going to research online what I want to buy first then go to a different store.

So my open question to the rest of you that are going to participate in this thread. If you were in my shoes and he was kicking you out how would you have responded?


Thanks RezZ

I would have just insisted I wasnt through looking around yet. As if I were planning on buying something...and then after I stayed long enough to blatently eaves drop his lame pick up game...(knowing all the while he's growing more irritated at my presence)then id just leave and say I changed my mind. The prices are cheaper at another store...I just remembered... But..have a nice day sir.

good idea but I wanted to put him in his place. I felt like he was being super disrespectful to me from the beginning before the girl even entered the picture.

Yeah from what you said he just sounds like a tard. I probally wouldnt have payed him any mind till i picked up on the fact he was trying to run game and my being there was bothering him. I can tune out people acting in the manner he was most the time. I mean...who am i to be drinking with the big boys?? I would definatley just laughed at that comment...and the other..eh. Thats just me...ive really just gotten to where I dont give a ****. Unless im really whiskey drunk or something...then were talking Dr.Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. Id say you handled it well overall. Look at the big picture..he's a bitter old man working at a liquor store and hitting on women he probally has no chance of getting... let him make his own misery.

Ooooh my god this is going to be so good.
I can't wait to see our forumgirls replying to this :D.

It if funny that you bring that up. I consider my two sides Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. My nickname is even Hyde. My wingman's name is Trap short for Venus Flytrap. I really don't like his methods but who I am to judge.

The reason he is called Venus Flytrap is because he says things that females would say to grab their attention and make himself seem like he's a very sensitive in touch with his softer side. He really is kind of like that but not as much as he puts on. So, he just looks pretty to the female eye and then when they fly near him he snatches them up. It's really their fault for falling for his smooth lines. They should know that no guy would actually say some of the things he says. You should see his facebook statuses and how he baits them to comment and like his status by saying certain things. It works like a charm all the time but I just don't agree with his approach. He is a little rough around the edges being a wingman as well but I need to train him some more.

For example, I was talking to this girl that works at the chinese restaurant. We are okay friends but I really like her. I know that she likes someone else so I don't pursue her anymore but I still playfully flirt. Well I said something to her and then he chimed in and made me look bad right in front of her. Even she noticed how mean/fucked up the comment was. He was back there laughing his butt off but what a dick move to pull and you are supposed to be my wingman. Your job isn't to put me down in front of potential targets. You are supposed to talk me up and show them my worth as a person. Show them my better positive sides.

I'm pretty sure they will bring their negativity in here but it's all good they are entitled to their opinions and I welcome them to come in here and say something.

Sounds like you stress a little about women. Just chill man..there are plenty out there. When your with them you want to be single and when your single you want a woman. As soon as you stop looking you find a good girl for ya. Just DONT GET MARRIED

I don't really think of it as stressing about women. I'm in the process of learning the ins and outs of women but it's very hard because you can't really just pin down certain types of women. They each have their own unique traits that you have to wing it and learn on the spot and play off of those traits to attract them if you want.

I'm treating this whole process like it is a science and I'm going through the trial and error stage at the moment.

I know that old saying, just be yourself and when the right one comes along she will find you when you least expect it.

I'm not really searching for a relationship but I would like to gain more female friends. I'd also like to have more booty call partners and other things. I like having my female friends compartmentalized into different categories. I'm sure s_k knows what I'm talking about.

still waiting for the advice ;)

What advice are you looking for? :confused:

you didn't explain your situation at all.

I'm not a mind reader.

I thought you were going to discuss different techniques at least =\
Thats all

Man, I had the exact same experience. I really liked this girl and was having some pretty good conversations with her, so eventually i grew a pair and asked her to see a movie. She accepted, so naturally I was excited and told one of my friends. So, later that week before the date I was talking to her in the halls and he walks up and is like "how are you going to pay for your tickets? you're so poor hahaha" and stuff like that. I'm not really poor, my parents are separated and can't afford f cking 56" plasma screens or a new computer whenever they want, but what really pissed me off is that he f cked me over :/ We never even ended up going on that date either.

Oh okay. I will get to that eventually. A little bit later on tonight I will do a run down of the lingo that I use. I'm not sure if Dirty uses the same terms that I do but I will explain them in detail. After I give the run down on the lingo then I will create a few scenarios and how you should handle them.

Man, I really hate cockblocks but when you are faced in situations like that. you can salvage the situation depending on what they said. In your situation, I would've told her he's a liar and he doesn't know anything about my life and just ask her what movie she wants to see and set the date. That was a situation where you could just keep pushing through the situation. I know how it feels though and sometimes you get disarmed and caught off guard by the cockblock that you don't know how to respond.

Hindsight is 20/20 but that was a relatively easy scenario to recover from. You could have even went as far to open your wallet and prove to her on the spot that you have money, if you were that desperate. If she left you though and listened to your friend, she probably wasn't worth it. Brush your shoulders off learn from that lesson and learn how to counter a situation like that in the future and not make the same mistake.

I get that but even if you choose to be single you aren't exactly players. You ask girls out over the internet and the other day Dirty said in the shoutbox that he was so desperate he'd **** anyone atm.

I don't claim to be a player and what decade are you living in? You do know that you can do both right?

Ask girls out over the internet AND do it in person. It will actually double your chances and give you more experience even if you fail.

I'm just trying to help some of you guys out but if you don't want our advice you don't have to take it.

I know most of the time I will be talking about experiences that have happened to me and analyzing what went wrong so I can fix it for the future.

I'll clarify and say I am not here to give techniques, advice, anything like that. I'd prefer to not even be mentioned in the OP and asked dj a few times in chat to remove me but i dont think he heard me. We had discussion over "pick up artist" stuff the other night and thats kinda what led to this thread. I personally don't know why these pick up techniques and stuff get so much hate and I'd like a female, or male who disagrees with "The Game" (book by Neil Strauss I think) to explain why.

Also, I want to be single.


Nope, didn't say that. Thought I should clear that up a little bit for ya.

Protips:

-If a girl listens to your friend trash you rather than get to know you herself, she's probably not worth your time. Neither is your friend if he has to cut you down in front of anyone, no matter a potential **** or not

-Self confidence is not gained from your relationships with other people. One cannot gain self worth from another person. CODEPENDENCY IS NOT HEALTHY.

- If you let someone walk all over you, you become part of the drama triangle. It means YOU are at fault as much as the other person. Maybe you need to look at yourself before you worry about getting with other people.

But I guess, you know, if you brahs want to attract bimbos just to ****, disregard that, after all, I'm a boring half of a boring couple.

You said something like "I need to lower my standards, gonna go to a club and take home whoever will have me".

Definitely wrong here. Human relationships are a huge part of anyone's confidence and health. They are very important.

Or are you talking strictly about boyfriend/girlfriend relationships

No, she is right. Co-dependency is horrible and I don't advocate it. It doesn't help your self esteem to have to rely on someone else to give you compliments. You need to love yourself before you can expect others to love you. Oh and btw. I took your name out of it Dirty. I will go through all the other posts and remove your name from them as well.

Exactly. that's what beta males need to learn. To stop letting someone else walk over them and to take more pride in themselves. They should have more pride and self-worth to not let someone take advantage of them. That all comes in time while they build their self confidence though.
The point of this isn't just to attract bimbos it's to get comfortable with the idea of being able to talk to women period. Majority of women like guys that have some confidence but there is a thin line between having too much confidence and being an ego maniac which is a turn off to them mostly.

I'm talking about any relationships. Like Andrei said, you need to love yourself first. If you gain your worth from other people, what are you going to do when they are gone? Relationships like that are taxing on both parties, and are parasitic. Relationships are a good means of support, but ABOVE ALL you should be in love with yourself more than anyone else. Otherwise it leads to aforementioned parasitic relationships, you lend yourself to a role that is easily manipulated by another person.

I just added that as an afterthought, just in case thats what people are looking for. Nevertheless, guys, remember: We really like it if you listen to us and maintain eye contact. If a girl (or boy even, this works both ways) is looking at you like you don't have the right to be in their atmosphere, move the **** on. We're not ravenous beasts and we don't **** diamonds.
We also really like it if you engage us in a conversation about something that doesn't have to do with relationships. And if we're talking to you about something and you can tell it's something we really care about, listen even if it bores you. We dig that.

And to be perfectly honest, I don't think this concerns beta-males so much as it does beta-humans, I guess you could say. Maybe it affects you guys more because you are conditioned to be the dominant ones & are punished for doing anything remotely effeminate (like being submissive)

I just wanted my name removed cause I am not a guru and can't teach everyone everything but I still am gonna give advice on any situations that come up and discuss things.

It's definitely good to be a dependent person. Positive relationships with other people IS healthy though. If you hate yourself and are depressed then you aren't gonna just magically feel better cause someone gave you a compliment, but meeting new people and having friends and socializing is absolutely healthy. A level of self-confidence is definitely gained through relationships with other people. It's called having good social health.


Good way to approach girls at a bar or party that you don't already know: Go up to a group, and say "Hey I gotta get back to my friends but we wanted some girls opinions on this:" Then ask any question requiring them to answer and start a conversation. Like I usually say "my buddy just started dating this girl, should he totally stop contact with his ex?" And then that leads to a little discussion which really isn't the important part. The main thing is that through talking (about anything) you just get more comfortable around those people. After 5 minutes of talking, pull the ole "Oh, my names ___ by the way" and then start talking on a more personal level like what they study, where they work, where they are form, that sort of stuff. Be unserious, laugh a lot, and make sarcastic jokes and jabs. People have different opinions and definitions of "negging" but I think it's just part of flirting. Like making a rude type of remark about something they are wearing but do it in a way where you can both laugh about it.

Do enlighten us on what "social health" is

No problem. I went back and found a great book I read last semester for one of Sociology courses.


AwwSugar, the definition you gave pertains to a society and it's social health. For an INDIVIDUAL though, social health is being a part of the society they exist in. Being engaged in activity, having friends, being social. Basically being a part of something and conforming to the societal norms, "fitting in" to an extent which provides confidence and encouragement. And I don't mean "fitting in" like being considered cool in high school or something like that. Just being a part of society by being a member who participates, and not isolated which is a good way to get yourself depressed. Being active and social gives you self esteem and confidence and encouragement. That's what I think social health is.

Does every relationship with all of your friends qualify as an intimate one? Intimacy is one thing, and I don't deny that it is a genuine need for intimacy people have, not socialisation as you are defining it. It even states that intimacy is special, so obviously you're not going to have it in ALL of your relationships with other people.

Being engaged in activity and having friends is GREAT, don't get me wrong but conforming to have them is not something you should advocate. If you change yourself just to fit in and repress your true self, it is extremely unhealthy. Friends should be people who understand you and accept you for WHO YOU ARE and not who you are pretending to be. There's no intimacy in those types of relationships and they are very damaging to one's self image. It's a blatant message of "You have to change WHO YOU ARE otherwise, people won't like you". Um, no, if that's the case, you should find people who do like you for who you are. People should be free to fly their freak flags, and have freaky friends. Being accepted should not be a goal, accepting yourself should be.

Besides, being part of a group is not necessarily the best thing for everyone. You forget take in account that some people are naturally introverted, and prefer solitude over sociability.

I feel like it affects guys more because that's the way society has it set up. You rarely see a female that likes a guy go up and approach him. We are expected to take that role and go over to approach them. It takes confidence to do that it's not even about being dominant vs. being submissive.

The only reason I put your name down is because I thought you wanted to be a part of this type of thread based off of our conversation we had in the shoutbox the other night. I will take the brunt of it though. I don't claim to be an expert player or a ladies man or w/e either. That's why there is a disclaimer that you don't have to take our advice the final choice is completely up to you.

I guess the technical term for what you are describing there is opening a set. That is a perfect example of how to open a set. A set being a group of females but sets can also include males as well. You just want to put yourself out there and get a conversation going. I normally don't "neg" often but it's a fun trick to pull out every now and then just to see the reaction that you get. It definitely takes time and practice to know what exactly to say and how rude to be but it's usually something light hearted that gets a conversation started also. A good way to use a neg is if you want to attempt to get the female alone to yourself when she's in a group. A great example of this happened in the movie "Hitch". He went up to the girl that was crowded with guys and give her his money and told her a drink he wanted then walked away quickly so that she could follow him and then he could talk to her more.

I certainly don't want to speak for her, he can explain himself but I don't think that's what he meant.
The whole fitting in thing comes as a part of being yourself and being in a group that accepts you the way you are. You are being yourself and you haven't changed for anyone but you do belong to a group so you are "fitting" in, in a sense.

It is society that dictates how we interact with other people. I also put the blame onto stereotypes and religion, particularly christianity.
Guys are expected to be masculine and do all the things men are supposed to do, like play sports and drive the girl around. Sports are something that society expects men to do, like football. Just how much emphasis is placed on football? Aren't all the cool guys in the football team?

Also the stereotypes, if you play computer games then you are a nerd/geek; if you read lots of books ... you get the idea.
People even get judged by their looks. Do you wear black clothing? What about wearing glasses? Long hair?

Religion is something that also dictates how we act. Christianity says that men are the carers, providers, the leader of the house and they must be masculine; while women must take the submissive path, looking after kids, helping their husband, ect.

Why is there still a glass ceiling?
Ever noticed that there is a tonne of ads for women about being beautiful and 'perfect'?
Ever noticed that in romantic movies, you get a nerdy guy who gets lucky with a hot girl? Never the other way round ... with exception to Shallow Hal.

I dont mean to disrupt a good conversation but this thread is definitely straying from its intended purpose and because a catalyst for an argument/debate on roles of men vs women in society.

I only say this because I like the thread idea and Id like to see it be used. Therefore Ill present a question for anyone to answer since I would have a hard time describing it myself.

You mention "negs" which I think most guys understand a little bit but dont ever use (myself included) because they dont know how to implement them or dont want to be viewed as an arsehole. So explain what exactly it is and how exactly one could pull it off.