The Jamal Khashoggi case

OccultHawk · 10-20-2018, 08:30 AM

Quote:

maybe backing Saudi Arabia is actually the least bad option at the moment

FTR, Iran was well on the way to being a shining star of liberalism in the Muslim world before we radicalized them and funded their horrible war with Iraq. If we hadn’t been so set on constantly destabilizing the Middle East maybe we would have trading partners who aren’t monsters.

The people of Iran have been calling out for cultural liberation for decades. The women used to wear blue jeans and sunglasses and went to discos and all that. We have been ****ing with them forever. It’s bull****.

The Batlord · 10-20-2018, 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lisnaholic

^ Governments are understandably cautious about suddenly changing allegiances in an area as volatile as the Middle East, so if you're hoping to see any dramatic action I think you'll be disappointed, adidasss.
Long-term, it might be possible to undermine the Saudi's strong global position, and here's how:-

Why would the American government give a **** about our opinions on Saudi Arabia? It's a big issue for 9/10 people who don't exist and the economic and political realities of changing our relationship with them would be extreme. So long as politicians do nothing and let things be as they've always been they know full well it won't endanger their re-elections, whereas if they try rocking the boat they paint a target on their ass.

adidasss · 10-21-2018, 01:52 AM

It's also nice to see how the story is covered by some of Saudi Arabia's other BFFs. This is from the leading UAE newspaper:

https://www.thenational.ae/world/men...grows-1.782387

Quote:

Senior scholars in Saudi meanwhile have praised the kingdom's response. The country's highest religious body, the Council of Senior Scholars, on Saturday said the king's decisions on the death of Khashoggi would "achieve justice and equality in accordance with Islamic law", according to a statement on state news agency SPA.

Walid Al-Sama'ani, Saudi's justice minister, said on Saturday that the judiciary had "full independence" to deal with the Khashoggi case and that "the issue will take its regular course...and will reach the judiciary after the completion of the prosecution requirements", according to the Saudi Press Agency.

So much lulz.

Lisnaholic · 10-22-2018, 06:03 AM

^ That's an interesting but sinister-sounding quote!

It's about 19 days after Jamal's murder and despite multiple attempts the Saudi's still don't have a lie in place that stands up to any scrutiny. The footage revealed today of a body double strolling out of the embassy in Jamal's clothes is damning evidence of pre-meditation imo.

And here's some context, some pattern-of-behaviour stuff about how three or four other Saudi critics have gone missing in the last year:-

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-mi...-going-missing

adidasss · 10-22-2018, 07:13 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=41wj-5YKzkQ

Wow.

But even with this there is still room for the Saudis to claim the top of the government didn't know. What I read today was that apparently they traced some phone calls to the Prince's office after the murder. I think that's as good of a smoking gun they'll ever get.

Everything now depends on Turkey and what their interest here is. If they want the Saudis in trouble, they have the means to put them in trouble. If they get something in return, this could all very easily go away. But it seems, according to the information leaking, from turkish officials, that they mean business.

Let's see what Erdogan will do on Tuesday.

adidasss · 10-23-2018, 01:16 AM

Very interesting analysis of the situation:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ogan-wants-him

Quote:

Erdoğan has the Saudis – in particular, the crown prince, Mohammed bin Salman (AKA MbS) – right where he wants him. Out of crisis has come opportunity for the veteran Turkish leader, who has never warmed to the brash 33-year-old, and thinks even less of his regional allies.

The two men have vastly different visions for the future of the region: Erdoğan has been a champion of political Islam both at home and abroad, particularly since the rise and fall of Mohamed Morsi, the ill-fated former president of Egypt who hailed from the Muslim Brotherhood. The Turkish president has partnered with Qatar, Riyadh’s regional foe, given shelter to those exiled after Morsi fell, and remained a bulwark for a movement that Riyadh and its ally the United Arab Emirates see as existential threats.

But he has remained on the losing end of the struggle for regional power and influence.

The prince, meanwhile, has been attempting to remodel Saudi Arabia, eschewing its deep links to the Wahhabi, Salafi religious establishment and turning it into an Arab nationalist police state. Abu Dhabi and Cairo are models here. And with Riyadh, the triumvirate had been in the ascendant regionally, ever since Morsi fell.

For Erdoğan, the gruesome killing marks a historic moment: a chance to turn the tables gifted to him by a cruel and reckless act that has sparked lasting revulsion, even among the kingdom’s allies.

A check mate situation, gifted to Erdogan. I have to say I don't particularly care for the man, as I don't like any autocrat, but I do hope he takes this chances and shakes up the region.

~~[MERIT]~~ · 10-23-2018, 01:26 AM

Turkey puts fiancee of slain journalist Khashoggi under 24-hour protection

~~[MERIT]~~ · 10-23-2018, 01:27 AM

► Saudis Scrap Murder Cover-Up As KHASHOGGI Body Double Wears Wrong Shoes

windsock · 10-23-2018, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [MERIT]

► Saudis Scrap Murder Cover-Up As KHASHOGGI Body Double Wears Wrong Shoes

Lmao I love this black comedy we're all living in.

adidasss · 10-23-2018, 06:03 PM

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...anctions-visas

Quote:

Twenty-one Saudis will have their US visas revoked or be made ineligible for US visas over the journalist’s killing, a state department spokeswoman, Heather Nauert, said on Tuesday.

Murica lays the smackdown. Justice is served.

10-22-2018, 06:03 AM	#74 (permalink)
Lisnaholic ...here to hear... Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: He lives on Love Street Posts: 4,444	^ That's an interesting but sinister-sounding quote! It's about 19 days after Jamal's murder and despite multiple attempts the Saudi's still don't have a lie in place that stands up to any scrutiny. The footage revealed today of a body double strolling out of the embassy in Jamal's clothes is damning evidence of pre-meditation imo. And here's some context, some pattern-of-behaviour stuff about how three or four other Saudi critics have gone missing in the last year:- https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-mi...-going-missing __________________ "Am I enjoying this moment? I know of it and perhaps that is enough." - Sybille Bedford, 1953

10-22-2018, 07:13 AM	#75 (permalink)
adidasss Slavic gay sauce Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Abu Dhabi Posts: 7,993	https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=41wj-5YKzkQ Wow. But even with this there is still room for the Saudis to claim the top of the government didn't know. What I read today was that apparently they traced some phone calls to the Prince's office after the murder. I think that's as good of a smoking gun they'll ever get. Everything now depends on Turkey and what their interest here is. If they want the Saudis in trouble, they have the means to put them in trouble. If they get something in return, this could all very easily go away. But it seems, according to the information leaking, from turkish officials, that they mean business. Let's see what Erdogan will do on Tuesday.

10-23-2018, 01:26 AM	#77 (permalink)
~~[MERIT]~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Missouri, USA Posts: 4,814	Turkey puts fiancee of slain journalist Khashoggi under 24-hour protection

10-23-2018, 01:27 AM	#78 (permalink)
~~[MERIT]~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Missouri, USA Posts: 4,814	► Saudis Scrap Murder Cover-Up As KHASHOGGI Body Double Wears Wrong Shoes