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Old 10-09-2009, 05:02 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by mr dave View Post
what's the deal with spooky tooth? never heard of them or their metal claim - but i'm quite curious now hehe.

I went into this in the History of Heavy Metal thread, with Youtube examples so you can verify or disagree with your own ears, but here's a potted version of what I actually spread over 3 or possibly more posts;


After the band The V.I.P.s became the first band in England to have Jimi Hendrix jam with them onstage at one of their gigs, they decided to change their style and name.

They became known as "Art" in 1967, (temporarily as it turned out, as they changed lineup and name to Spooky Tooth in 1968) and went into the studio with a graphic design company called Hapshash and the Coloured Coat, where they used the pseudonym "The Heavy Metal Kids" - thus owning the first legitimate use of the term in connection with music.

Here's the album cover so you can verify it yourself;



This nice story is only spoiled a little bit by the fact that the Hapshash album is about a million miles away from heavy metal, and both Art's only LP "Supernatural Fairy Tales" and Spooky Tooth's 1968 debut are both heavy psyche bordering on early heavy rock.

Spooky Two, released in either late 1968 or early 1969, depending on who you believe, is a clear influence on bands like Deep Purple, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath and Blue Oyster Cult.


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Originally Posted by mr dave View Post
as far as i've always known the 'heavy metal thunder' line from Born to be Wild was the first use of the term in lyrics.

The Steppenwolf claim to earliest metal song is therefore not without weight although

a) I'd rather not see heavy metal as a Canadian invention, given the quality of music that generally emerges from that fine country (Rush apart) and

b) It doesn't really sound like metal to me - IF Motorhead and Metallica are the benchmarks of what metal is.


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Originally Posted by mr dave View Post
prior to that some journalists compared Jimi Hendrix's 'exp' track (the psychedelic noise opener to Axis: Bold as Love) to the sound of heavy metals falling from the sky and (supposedly) marked the first time the terms were used to describe music.
Now this is interesting - I'd like to see the report, if that's possible, and find out the exact dates of a) the journalist's assessment, and b) the recording and release of the Hapshash album.

Any linkage?

If it ain't documented, it's heresay.


update: Date of release of "Axis" is December 1 1967, so it's looking like the Spookies have it.

Last edited by Certif1ed; 10-09-2009 at 05:15 AM.
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Old 10-09-2009, 10:34 AM   #12 (permalink)
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While "Welcome Home" has heavy and metallic passages, particularly towards the end, I wouldn't call it a song that defines metal.

This would imply that metal has to have acoustic passages, be slow, and have its main licks stolen from someone else's songs

As for Black Sabbath - are you including "The Wizard" among "Anything"?

That track sounds a lot like early Jethro Tull to me, so by implication, you're saying that Tull are the epitome of metal. Shurely shome mishtake?


update: Hmm... the post I replied to has gone mysteriously AWOL.

Dio was the other consideration made - and I didn't reply immediately because

a) I don't know all the band's albums

b) Dio (the band) are a bit of a conundrum as far as the definition of metal is concerned;

In many ways, both "Holy Diver" and "The Last In Line" are a brilliant and concise summary of what Heavy Metal was all about in the pre-thrash 1980s - not bad for an American band.





On the other hand, despite the technical proficiency, impeccable song structuring, smokin' riffs and all-out heavy metal rock and rollness of the band, who were awesome live, the music smacked heavily of commercial orientation, what with stupid songs like "Mystery", and Dio the band were more like a commercial machine than a "proper" metal band from dahn the pub, as we say in England. They'd pretty much sold out from the word go - but hey, most of the music was great.



I didn't like "Sacred Heart" or "Dream Evil" at the time - but at that time I was almost completely absorbed in thrash, being in a thrash band myself, and found the music too samey and old.





If you think about it, this is a bit hypocritical of me, given that Ronnie James Dio only ever sang about Rainbows, Wizards and Stars in the 30 years or so after he introduced Elf to Ritchie Blackmore. With a voice like that, though, he could repeat himself ad nauseam and theoretically at least, no-one should care what the words are, as long as he doesn't stop singing!






Some of the stuff on "Last In Line" is particularly worth revisiting - the range of different material, from the adrenaline fuelled power metal of "I Speed At Night" to the pulsing Prog Metal of "Egypt" to the evil MTV-pleasing "Mystery", there really is something for everyone here;





For two years, I'd agree - Dio did define metal, and for this and the stuff he did with Rainbow and Black Sabbath (even though it's exactly the same), he gets a triple entry into the metal Hall of Fame.


Now where's the Devil Horns emoticon when you need it?

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Old 10-09-2009, 02:58 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Dio (band) has rocked out some great songs this decade as well Just check out Eriel from Magica (2000).



I saw a Heaven & Hell concert a few months ago (Sabbath w/Dio) and the old man was still excellent. Lots of energy and while he's a bit tacky and weird in his videos, he still has lots of charisma and persona on the stage. I consider him a great man and one of the greatest voices in metal of course
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Old 10-09-2009, 04:01 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Certif1ed View Post
a) I'd rather not see heavy metal as a Canadian invention, given the quality of music that generally emerges from that fine country (Rush apart) and

Now this is interesting - I'd like to see the report, if that's possible, and find out the exact dates of a) the journalist's assessment, and b) the recording and release of the Hapshash album.

Any linkage?

If it ain't documented, it's heresay.

update: Date of release of "Axis" is December 1 1967, so it's looking like the Spookies have it.
as far as the steppenwolf thing i didn't mean to say they sounded metal just that they were using the term within their music. i'm also kind of saddened at the candian diss we've had better bands than rush. voivod isn't exactly poo.

as for the hendrix thing i remember reading it in the liner notes to 'axis: bold as love' years ago. while there would be an obvious bias in those notes, this is the first time in the years since that the claim has been challenged in a worthwhile way.
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I type whicked fast,
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Old 10-09-2009, 05:35 PM   #15 (permalink)
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/facepalm
I know.
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Old 10-09-2009, 06:01 PM   #16 (permalink)
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I know.
I was just wondering out loud why people like to write posts with basically no content. Rhetorical questions or pointing out observations is not interesting to all of us. It's a forum, not a chatroom
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Old 10-10-2009, 01:26 AM   #17 (permalink)
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i'm also kind of saddened at the candian diss we've had better bands than rush. voivod isn't exactly poo.
Yeah - the Canadian diss just slipped out. Sorry about that - I have some good friends who are Canadian.
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Old 10-10-2009, 12:18 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Bands like Sepultura and Tang Dynasty definitely define parts of cultural metal. Sepultura have used cultural instruments in their music and also based quite a bit of their songs on the whole idea. X Japan have also based their band on cultural exploitations. They define the metal of their culture and possibly the whole idea of cultural metal.
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Old 10-10-2009, 01:24 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Master! Master!....Metallica and Slayer were my first tastes of metal so "Master of Puppets" and "Raining Blood" are the 2 songs that define it for me. And 2 songs I doubt I will EVER get sick of.
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Old 10-10-2009, 02:19 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Bands like Sepultura and Tang Dynasty definitely define parts of cultural metal. Sepultura have used cultural instruments in their music and also based quite a bit of their songs on the whole idea. X Japan have also based their band on cultural exploitations. They define the metal of their culture and possibly the whole idea of cultural metal.
I'm vaguely familiar with Sepultura - they're still on my "must get around to listen to" list. Any suggestions of albums/songs to start with - which one is best to start off with, and which really shows the cultural side??

I've never heard of those other bands - could you make similar recommendations for them?


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Master! Master!....Metallica and Slayer were my first tastes of metal so "Master of Puppets" and "Raining Blood" are the 2 songs that define it for me. And 2 songs I doubt I will EVER get sick of.
Word.

My favourites from those legendary albums are "Battery" and "Criminally Insane" respectively.

I'd say, however, that "Master...", while an astonishing piece, goes so far beyond the remit of metal that it redefines what the genre can be - and I'm not sure anyone has caught up with it yet.

The album itself, as a collective whole, is certainly a definition of what metal could be if it tried to - rich and varied, rather than micro-focussed into a myriad of similar sounding subgenres.

After "Ride The Lightning", I'd say it's the second Progressive Metal album proper - and, as an expression of heavy metal, it's without equal.


"Reign in Blood" is a different redefinition - there's not a huge amount of variation, but there's enough that what it achieves within a narrow vein is perfect, and remains a benchmark of brutality, speed and heavy metal intensity combined with a perfect feel for what's "right".

It's in no way a corporate clone or a product tailored to fit a market - it's raw heavy metal, like it or not, and it kicks serious ass.

IMHO
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