The American Football Thread

[Forward To Death]

Originally Posted by butthead aka 216

what lol of course it plays into this. dafuq you talkin bout. martin is/was soft, hes always been that way compared to other nfl players cause that's ust his personality. from everything ive read or seen, all the dolphins support incognito. tannehill even said incognito and martin were like best friends. i think the voicemail and stuff might be taken out of context big time. i think the only thing incognito did wrong was probably the 15K for the vegas trip thing. most of it just sounds overblown and a witchhunt

your last paragraph and part I bolded....dude, that's literally his job. his job is to manipulate psyche's to make ppl the best they can be. your suggestion is completely absurd in every way. can already tell you're one of the dodos who prob wanted paterno burned at the stake too

It doesn't matter who the players support, it's a legal matter now. The fact that it's part of his personality just supports my argument better that he should've just been left alone in the first place and none of this would have happened. He isn't soft, are you kidding me? Mental/verbal abuse isn't part of football. What's your point, that he got pissed off because he was called a ****** and threatened, so he's a soft football player? Like I said, it undermines the fact that he plays in the NFL. Try again.

It's his job to manipulate Martin's psyche? Is he a psychologist? Here I thought it was the coaches job to just keep the locker room together and to call a few plays. I didn't know they were required to know of how certain personalities would react to certain situations, but then again I don't think Phillbin could have either. His plan to get Martin out of his shell has completely backfired, so there goes that theory.

What's your opinion on Paterno? Not that it has anything to do with this.

[butthead aka 216]

Originally Posted by Forward To Death

It doesn't matter who the players support, it's a legal matter now. The fact that it's part of his personality just supports my argument better that he should've just been left alone in the first place and none of this would have happened. He isn't soft, are you kidding me? Mental/verbal abuse isn't part of football. What's your point, that he got pissed off because he was called a ****** and threatened, so he's a soft football player? Like I said, it undermines the fact that he plays in the NFL. Try again.

It's his job to manipulate Martin's psyche? Is he a psychologist? Here I thought it was the coaches job to just keep the locker room together and to call a few plays. I didn't know they were required to know of how certain personalities would react to certain situations, but then again I don't think Phillbin could have either. His plan to get Martin out of his shell has completely backfired, so there goes that theory.

What's your opinion on Paterno? Not that it has anything to do with this.

your idea of coaching is just....so so wrong and theres really no other way to put it. you dont consider motivation part of coaching?? thats what im seeing you say here basically. ive really never heard anyone say those things about coachin who was an avid fan of the game and im kinda taken aback by it

and martin is SOFT. he just is. he was comin out of college. every team knew it. it was a concern for teams. it was on his scouting reports. maybe nfl/locker room culture isnt for him cause hes got some issues to work out. thats his problem, not footbals.


5 minute incognito interview

and what do ya know....i was completely right lol. theres a video of richie goin through what happened and the whole situation. him and martin were BEST FRIENDS ON THE TEAM and he was jokin around with a buddy on that PRIVATE voicemail.


this is all a media witchhunt with 'bully' as their buzzword and which 95% of fans buy into cause they're gullible and cant form their own thoughts and it wont stop til philbin is fired, and maybe jeff ireland


offtopic: i love joe paterno and think he was unfairly crucified and vilified by the media and just ppl in general

[p-bo]

I've been a Penn St fan since 1985 and my opinion on Paterno is this: At BEST he stood around and did nothing. He's not the police. He's not an investigator. But he was aware of what happened, and the predator was still a huge presence on campus after that. Don't you thing, as Paterno, that 5 days later, or 5 months later, or 5 years later, when you still see that piece of **** walking around campus, that you might ask why? Maybe inquire. Maybe take action, seeing how you're the single most powerful person within a 200 mile radius? I've lost all respect for Paterno, most of my love for that school, and most of my faith in people. The only people, besides the victims, I have any sympathy for are the current players.

[butthead aka 216]

Originally Posted by p-bo

I've been a Penn St fan since 1985 and my opinion on Paterno is this: At BEST he stood around and did nothing. He's not the police. He's not an investigator. But he was aware of what happened, and the predator was still a huge presence on campus after that. Don't you thing, as Paterno, that 5 days later, or 5 months later, or 5 years later, when you still see that piece of **** walking around campus, that you might ask why? Maybe inquire. Maybe take action, seeing how you're the single most powerful person within a 200 mile radius? I've lost all respect for Paterno, most of my love for that school, and most of my faith in people. The only people, besides the victims, I have any sympathy for are the current players.

it just makes no sense to me that everyone was quick to demonize paterno. theres a lot of unknowns. like what did he know, did he cover it up, etc. and if any coach in the history or sports has earned the right to benefit of the doubt, its joe pa. and absolutely nobody gave him any benefit of the doubt which just makes no sense to me. i think the media and public at large just wanted to tear down an icon. i still love psu football and always will love that community but my general thoughts on the school have turned sour and bitter.

i feel like the board of trustee at psu have no backbone and didnt stand behind the man who built the program and honestly the school itself. in short, joepa gave too much and did too much for everyone in the school and when push came to shove the ppl who shoulda had his back betrayed him





back on topic, incognito either did, or is goin to, release the hundreds of texts between him and martin. the truth is lookin more and more like i imagined it. martin - mental issues, soft. incognito - easy scapegoat for the media to claw into. mob mentality ensues.

[Forward To Death]

Originally Posted by butthead aka 216

your idea of coaching is just....so so wrong and theres really no other way to put it. you dont consider motivation part of coaching?? thats what im seeing you say here basically. ive really never heard anyone say those things about coachin who was an avid fan of the game and im kinda taken aback by it

Motivation is definitely part of coaching. Trying to manipulate someone's personality to "come out of their shell" is not.

and martin is SOFT. he just is. he was comin out of college. every team knew it. it was a concern for teams. it was on his scouting reports. maybe nfl/locker room culture isnt for him cause hes got some issues to work out. thats his problem, not footbals.

I've never seen this on his scouting report, the burden of proof is on you, because it's your claim. Is he soft because his entire locker room was dogging him for 2 years? I'm sorry, but I don't buy that.

5 minute incognito interview

and what do ya know....i was completely right lol. theres a video of richie goin through what happened and the whole situation. him and martin were BEST FRIENDS ON THE TEAM and he was jokin around with a buddy on that PRIVATE voicemail.

So you're saying Incognito's defending himself? Gasp! He must be innocent. This is truly breaking news, and I've never seen such conclusive evidence in my life.

Why would Martin make this up, why would Incognito threaten him, and whether or not he was joking doesn't change anything. He took it seriously for some reason. Why would he do that? Are you saying that Martin took it as a joke but is pressing charges anyways, or are you saying that he took it as the threat it was.

this is all a media witchhunt with 'bully' as their buzzword and which 95% of fans buy into cause they're gullible and cant form their own thoughts and it wont stop til philbin is fired, and maybe jeff ireland

I agree a lot of people don't think about the context of what happened, but it kind of sounds like they liked to talk **** back and forth to each other. I wouldn't call that being friends at all.

offtopic: i love joe paterno and think he was unfairly crucified and vilified by the media and just ppl in general

He looked the other way when kids were being molested. There's nothing else that needs to be said to demonize him, he does it for himself.

[djchameleon]

Originally Posted by Forward To Death

I agree a lot of people don't think about the context of what happened, but it kind of sounds like they liked to talk **** back and forth to each other. I wouldn't call that being friends at all.

Friends **** talk each other but they also let them know when they have crossed the line and said some **** they don't like.

[Forward To Death]

Anyways, I don't really care that much about this issue but it's interesting.

I think Incognito thought that he was being friendly, but didn't get that when Martin was telling him to shut the **** up, he really wanted him to shut the **** up and back off. I know guys like that, they're psychopaths who don't understand the difference between right and wrong and usually have no regard for the personal space of others. He was probably intruding, and Martin felt suffocated and eventually just snapped.

If Martin was soft, he wouldn't have been going back and forth with him for this long, but almost everyone has a limit. Some of the most chilled out dudes I know have limits, you pester them with BS for so long they're going to flip their ****. Calling him soft because he reacted to repeated teasing, which Incognito's teammates say he's prone to doing, is absolutely ridiculous.

He should definitely have told him to knock the **** off, but that usually doesn't work for someone like a Richie Incognito. If he couldn't take the hint and **** off, what makes me think he would respond positively to reason? Who's to say he didn't reason with him, and he continued to **** with him? You don't know all of the facts yet. Believe me, I've thought about the context plenty, this is my own opinion, not ESPN's, not NFL.com's. I've thought about maybe Martin was just taking it too seriously, but that ignores a lot of the other facts. I don't think one incident of a friend jokingly threatening to kill you causes a mental breakdown, and I'd be willing to bet if you sat and thought about it for a few minutes, you'd come to the same conclusion.

[Forward To Death]

Originally Posted by djchameleon

Friends **** talk each other but they also let them know when they have crossed the line and said some **** they don't like.

That's what I'm saying. It obviously wasn't "just a joke" if he checked himself into a hospital for treatment. It was persistent, I promise you that.

[p-bo]

My experiences from suburban high school in New York agree with you. You have kids who get bullied and do their best to avoid those situations. Then you have those who get bullied and come back for more. The crave acceptance and think they will eventually fit in or the bullying will stop. My guess would be Martin is closer to the latter. He wanted to be a part of the locker room and he wanted to be a good sport. He just had enough.

[Forward To Death]

Originally Posted by p-bo

My experiences from suburban high school in New York agree with you. You have kids who get bullied and do their best to avoid those situations. Then you have those who get bullied and come back for more. The crave acceptance and think they will eventually fit in or the bullying will stop. My guess would be Martin is closer to the latter. He wanted to be a part of the locker room and he wanted to be a good sport. He just had enough.

Absolutely.

In a team sport, if you're smart you don't want to clash with your teammates, especially someone like Incognito who obviously has a lot of support in the locker room. Everyone's going to take his side (which is what's happening now) and it's not going to end well for you, especially when you're a rookie/sophomore, he wasn't going to accomplish anything by taking a stand. It's all perception in a clique like that, the ones who are longest in the tooth are the ones who are going to be perceived favorably no matter what the situation. I think the fact that he was being treated like a rookie in his 2nd year is entirely BS; every rookie should go through that process just because it does teach them some respect, and that's just the way things work in society, you work your way up. They didn't let him graduate from that though, they treated him like he was a piece of **** and they made sport of teasing him in the locker room. Save it for the rookies, and let the sophomores get in on some it, otherwise their progress as a teammate is just going to stagnate, and the entire purpose of "hazing" the rookie is defeated.