No, I just won't suck farts out of his bumhole just because he's English.

All I have said, based on watching Rooney play live on numerous occasions and watching every United match possible, is that he is not as good as people make out and he is inconsistent. I've given very reasonable arguments to back my claims. You on the other hand have resorted to trying to insult me :p:

Having an opinion I believe to be well informed and grounded does not mean I dislike Rooney. I have already said, I'm English. I'd love it if he proved me wrong and returned to his 2009 form consistently. As it stands, I don't think he will, and his relaxed approach to the game and in particular his fitness, makes me think he will be burned out by the time he's 30.

Here's an idea. Why don't you concentrate on his positive contributions to his game. You'll find they far outweigh the negatives, as the stats quite clearly demonstrate.
Either that, or at least limit your Rooney remarks to at least 1 in every 3 of your posts.
Obsessed much?

I'm a football fan. I call things how I see them. I find I enjoy watching Rooney play more when you just enjoy what he is; a very good player who offers goals and the odd moment of genius. All my criticisms were fair.

Take Joe Hart for example, he is another English player the media are falling over themselves to label 'world class', yet he's been terrible all season, making more errors than David de Gea. Yet de Gea is the one who is crucified every week while Hart is lauded as the English saviour.

It's all hype mate, which I don't buy in to.

Not obsessed, this discussion is only happening because I happened to post once that I think Falcao is better than Rooney. I'm entitled to counter posts that disagree with me.

So take your own advice and at least single out a player that deserves your criticisms (and there are many more), rather than focusing on arguably the finest English footballer of his generation.

I haven't actually singled him out. If nobody had replied to my Falcao post I wouldn't be discussing Rooney. I admit I was on a wum last night after the England game.

As for the highlighted bit, I think Paul Scholes, Frank Lampard and Jack Wilshere would have something to say about that.

Well Scholesy and fat Frank have had a full career to establish their reputations. Rooney and Wilshire have it all to come just yet, before judgement is made.
You'll note, I did say, "arguably".

Forgot Ashley Cole too. Fantastic player. Not much older than Rooney either.

Yeah I'm sure Rooney's legacy will never match Cole's. :O
Cole is only 2 years younger than Lampard btw. 5 years older than Rooney?

Fluffy, you are jut wrong on this one. Simple really.

Maybe he is "overrated", let's move past that. Your actual judgement of the player is wide of the mark. I remember you were claiming things like Falcao being a better passer/dribbler than Rooney and having a higher work rate etc. That's just nonsense.

Rooney is the finest footballer of his generation, and only Paul Scholes surpasses him from any recent generation.

*English

lol

Cool evidence provided.

I remember you saying Rooney was a better passer, then the next game was away vs Swansea where Rooney was spraying passes to nobody left, right and centre. He was taken off because it was that bad.

As for dribbling; Rooney was a good dribbler pre-2009, I've seen him tear Roma to shreds on the wing and run at defences when he was playing for Everton. He doesn't dribble anymore. He was pushed further forward in 2009 to fill the void of Ronnie and since then he's not been successful at all when he's running at players. His game isn't about that anymore. He is played in the trequartista role but doesn't have the touch or passing to do it. I believe Rooney's best position is as an out and out striker. That was where his best season was, and I believe despite my criticisms, he can be good there as he does offer goals. He is also good at heading, Tony V had a field day in 2009/10 dinking balls onto Rooney's head. Rooney is no good playing behind the striker. He's also one of the best free-kick takers in the league if not Europe.

I also believe he is mentally weak, hence Ferguson leaving him out of the squad vs scouse teams God knows how many times.

Nothing you've said is based on any real evidence. It's all opinions. "You're just wrong", "that is nonsense" etc.

Who gives a sod about legacy? Ashley Cole has been consistently good for club and country for a decade and is probably the best in the world in his position; certainly the best over the past ten years at least. He's never the one to flop for England is he?

Remind me what Rooney did in the World Cup x 2? Don't worry, I'll wait.

As for age, well what is your point? Is Cole not the same generation as Rooney? He's played in all the same England teams at World Cups and Euros. Or do you mean best 27 year old player born in October? :rolleyes:

Rooney, the finest of his generation? Compared to who? ONLY scholes surpassing him???

He's an above average striker. He isn't that critical to his club and continually dissapoints (even more than most) on the international stage.

English players I would rate better than rooney, in no particular order

Ashley cole, lampard, gerrard, scholes, carragher, beckham, terry, baines, ferdinand, johnson (equal).

But, granted, if you're comparing him to downing, milner,cahill and hart then yeah.

I will say he is definately better than allen though! So maybe he IS the best afterall! Ha!

Such utter nonsense.

I agree. Nonsense.

Allen is fantastic, Gerrard is rubbish, and Rooney is the best of his generation.

Granted, he's kinda the best striker out of a poor bunch (excluding an uninjured owen)

He's obviously a miles better footballer than Michael Owen.

Miles better than the owen that came back post 2006 injury, he was out for an entire year and never really recovered.

No, miles better than Owen at any point.

Oh, how many times had rooney won the ballon d'or?

I agree with you that Owen was better than Rooney, however using the Ballon d'Or to strengthen your argument is poor. We saw from the list of votes that got published this year that it's not an accurate indication of a player's talent.

Thierry Henry was robbed in 2004. Robbed. The reason Ronaldinho won it that year was because he had a better brand, got votes from all the smaller countries, similar to how many people voted Balotelli this year even though he'd done nothing for City but had a good tournament with the Euros.

Mate that list of players you said were English and better than Rooney is really bad. Can't agree there.

Lampard, Gerrard, Scholes, Cole, Beckham, Rio. I agree with, Baines, Terry, Johnson and Carragher, no. Terry is an average defender btw, he's only rated so highly because he makes a mistake then throws himself in at the last minute to save the ball ala World Cup 2010 or the time Diaby nearly killed him. His poor reading of the game is the reason he ends up in so many of these last ditch tackles.

True, the ballon d'or isn't the strongest of points, but at least it's an actual point!

As for defenders...it's harder to get rated as a CB really anyway. Maybe I overreacted with him being rated ABOVE all the others so included ones in the same ballpark too, whatever. You agreed with 60% of them so it can't be that bad!

You guys are trying too hard. Yeah, I may rate Allen highly, but that's based on in depth analysis of his game. The fact that you can call Terry an average defender is just going too far.

In depth? After our subjective opinions clashed and you wouldn't accept the obvious(yours of which is in the complete minority ) I did the in depth analysis, and he was found wanting on all fronts bar the accuracy of short passes. Brendan's even had to drop him from the first team, maybe Brendan doesn't want him showing the rest of the team up.

But I agree that terry is above average, just like rooney!

Playing well/Being a quality player are not the same thing.

Terry is another case of a player being built up to be better than he is because he is English. Would take Carragher over Terry any day.

Butter is not cheese but they're both dairy products.

Yeah, good argument.

Terry was a World Class defender, now he's just good. Always better than Carragher.

Haha that is class.

Lol no, he is a liability. He's been making cock ups for years.

But he's brave isn't he?

Terry and carragher at their peaks are pretty much equal imo. But if I had to choose now I'd have to go for terry simply because he's got a couple of year on jamie.

Terry makes more mistakes, but has the ability to make up for them, and other peoples. Carragher has more tactical sense and positioning but not as much ability to dive in and shove people off.

Carragher makes more mistakes, worse on the ball, worse physically etc. Terry was/is just a better defender.

Okey dokey.

Here you go. Mancini and the boys would like you to have this, with their compliments...
http://epltalk.com/wp-content/upload...gue-trophy.jpg

This is just going too far! Reading should be censured for this! We have to stamp out this rampant racism in football. How he even agreed to wear a shirt with such a demeaning phrase on it is beyond me. What's next: yellow triangles? :laughing:
http://www.trollheart.com/reading2.png

Is that actually his name? :D

Right. Again.

Had another shocker today, the overrated, arrogant tosser.

It is, yeah. God does have a sense of humour after all! :rofl:

The only issue I have with the comment you quoted is that De Gea also makes lots of mistakes and is rightly criticised.

That's what I said.

When De Gea makes a mistake it's highlighted more though. Hart gets away with murder because he's English.

So, I used to follow the SPL Rangers in the mid-late 2000's. It just got harder to follow them when I could never watch their games in America and I moved on. I come back later this year and hear they're been relegated for financial reasons. I'm still unclear about what exactly happened and if someone had some sparknotes for that, that'd be awesome.

But anyway, now that ESPN regularly airs Premier League games and I can much more easily follow a team, I want to follow one of them. I'm pretty much neutral, so if anyone wants to sway me to their side or away from anther side... I'm all ears.