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Old 05-23-2017, 05:34 PM   #5841 (permalink)
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Hence my question, which he sort of answered but really just brushed over. If people are being used, manipulated and coerced by a religious dogma, does that make those people evil in themselves? Was every Crusader evil? Most were, granted, and greedy, but would you not accept that there were those who went because they thought they were doing God's will, and if so, does that make them inherently evil? Or just misguided? I wonder if I'll get an answer before I head to bed in about two hours.
Committing murder is evil, even if your god or government tells you to, but I think that's kind of beside the point.
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Old 05-23-2017, 05:35 PM   #5842 (permalink)
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Hence my question, which he sort of answered but really just brushed over. If people are being used, manipulated and coerced by a religious dogma, does that make those people evil in themselves? Was every Crusader evil? Most were, granted, and greedy, but would you not accept that there were those who went because they thought they were doing God's will, and if so, does that make them inherently evil? Or just misguided? I wonder if I'll get an answer before I head to bed in about two hours.
Misguided.
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Old 05-23-2017, 05:36 PM   #5843 (permalink)
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I think you're way off track Trollheart
Yeah possibly. Crusaders wasn't a great example, but I couldn't think of another off the cuff. You understand the point I'm trying to make though, yes? That not every muslim hates the West and wants to be a suicide bomber, but that there are multiple variables to factor in to why someone does that. You guys are better at arguing this stuff than I am, I admit it. I'll leave it to you.
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Old 05-23-2017, 05:36 PM   #5844 (permalink)
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Muslims are especially vulnerable to manipulation and exploitation.
bigotry makes Westerners really easy to manipulate

I haven't seen you be able to even grasp the concept that maybe we had something to do with the state of things

You're carrying on with this 18th century idea that the "other" are just savages
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Old 05-23-2017, 05:40 PM   #5845 (permalink)
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Committing murder is evil, even if your god or government tells you to, but I think that's kind of beside the point.
It's not beside my point because I'm arguing the religion is bad. Misguiding people is bad. And allowing yourself to be misguided is a shortcoming. Not an evil but I'm going to say worthy of bigotry because I want to give the widest berth possible to the word bigot to make it clear what I'm defending, which is bigotry.
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Old 05-23-2017, 05:44 PM   #5846 (permalink)
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It's not beside my point because I'm arguing the religion is bad. Misguiding people is bad. And allowing yourself to be misguided is a shortcoming. Not an evil but I'm going to say worthy of bigotry because I want to give the widest berth possible to the word bigot to make it clear what I'm defending, which is bigotry.
One can become evil even if they didn't start off that way.
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Old 05-23-2017, 05:49 PM   #5847 (permalink)
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bigotry makes Westerners really easy to manipulate

I haven't seen you be able to even grasp the concept that maybe we had something to do with the state of things

You're carrying on with this 18th century idea that the "other" are just savages
No, I'm not. You'll not find a more aggressive antagonist against America than me. I'm full of self-loathing, hate for America, and will argue against my own culture with perhaps more vehemence than anyone here. But today, I'm focused on my disgust with Islam.

And bigotry does make people easy to manipulate. Trump is a byproduct of white supremacy by all means. So please don't accuse me of being an apologist for the west. I'm not. We're dispicable.
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Old 05-23-2017, 05:50 PM   #5848 (permalink)
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And allowing yourself to be misguided is a shortcoming
irony
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Old 05-23-2017, 05:52 PM   #5849 (permalink)
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Old 05-23-2017, 05:55 PM   #5850 (permalink)
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I'm just glad OH is taking the beatings instead of me for a bit.
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