Goofle

Well, you showed me a list of socialist parties a few days ago and the first one I looked at brought up Marxism. It's not far fetched to use that term when discussing the leftist movements alive today.

Also I wouldn't say William is a leftist, I think I'd be right in saying he's a "classical liberal". Completely different.

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djchameleon

Damn I have been doing it so wrong. I could be having so much more fun.

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Fame, fortune, power, titties. People say these are the most crucial things in life, but you can have a pocket full o' gold and it doesn't mean sh*t if you don't have someone to share that gold with. Seems simple. Yet it's an important lesson to learn. Even lone wolves run in packs sometimes.

RoxyRollah

Yea get a pair of brass knucks one for each hand one says social other says justice and hit en with the two fisted punch!

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djchameleon

Not a bad idea!

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Fame, fortune, power, titties. People say these are the most crucial things in life, but you can have a pocket full o' gold and it doesn't mean sh*t if you don't have someone to share that gold with. Seems simple. Yet it's an important lesson to learn. Even lone wolves run in packs sometimes.

hip hop bunny hop

The truly lulzy thing is that William the Bloody Ignorant of Macroeconomics is being the biggest sjw here. All invective, bold type, emotional, conspiracy theorys and everything. It's amazing. He's wringing his little heart out. Apparently, white people who are being outperformed by immigrants who speak little english, have no social connections to their new city, and who often didn't complete 3rd world primary education.... well, those white people are just special and the rules shouldn't apply to them, and if you don't agree, he'll continue to white trash knight this forum for another thousand yeards.




Boom.

Anyways, Borjas is certainly not "the" most respected economist in regards to immigration. His opinion is decidedly unpopular within economist circles; he receives an undue amount of attention because his opinion gives creedence to the opinion of hate groups, such as FAIR (whom you referenced) which is considered a hate group by both the ADL & SPLC, and CIS (who is considered a hate group by the SPLC).

Which brings us back to:

This is a great point. How do we know immigrants exert minimal (if any) downward pressure on wages? Because they go to where they can sell their labor for the most money, meaning they go to places experiencing labor shortages and they work in fields (literal and figurative) experiencing labor shortages. Immigrants, just like you and me, would only live in an Iowa or Tennessee if there was a tremendous economic opportunity - they certainly ain't going there for the cultural experience.

N e ways, I see you didn't comment on the marginal propensity to save. You see, that's the economic fact that because the cost of living is static, the amount of income spent relative to net income decreases the more you make. Please, please, please consider the effect this has on working class cost of living before you comment again.

p.s., you do realize most unions in the USA have endorsed clinton, right?

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Have mercy on the poor.

The Batlord

I haven't read this whole post yet, and am not taking sides, but I'm just pointing out the WtB puts stuff in bold that he thinks are the most important parts of his posts, so that people too lazy to read everything can still get the gist of what he's saying. He does it in all of his longer posts, political or musical. Just FYI, to let you know he's not YELLING with his bold parts.

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William_the_Bloody

Please tell me where in the above where there is any note of conspiracy theories.

It is not my fault you don't present facts, but instead just hurl out accusations in hopes to make them stick.

Its actually not white americans whose wages will be hardest hit by mass immigration, but rather many black americans and minorities living in urban centers who have to compete with them, but thank you for pointing out that you believe people in this country shouldn't have their wages protected.

That is why I am a Bernie Sanders supporter, i suppose you side with the person interviewing him?






Boom.

I've seen this chart before, as I read Paul Krugman's blog regularly. The United States has a bigger drop in union rates because you've elected consecutive governments that have adopted right to work laws, and free trade deals, including the Clinton administration of the 90's.

NAFTA was the biggest job killer we ever had in Canada. It did create employment, but at a substantial decrease in annual income for the vast majority of workers that were displaced.

Whether you like it or not, Borjas is considered the premier immigration economist in the United States, and once more he is a liberal, from which Paul Krugman and Joseph Stiglitz take their cues from.

It doesn't matter who cites Borjas, what matters is that his evidence is peer reviewed and factual. If western civilization starts doing our research to suit our ideological biases, whether they be left wing or right wing were in a lot of trouble.


I've already provided some statistics on the downward pressure of wages its had on non skilled labourers, I would be happy to provide you with much more.

The vast majority of immigrants choose to live in urban centers which places them in direct competition for labour as other workers, study after study as shown that the reason that native labourers are less effected is because they are forced into education, which is time in effort itself, and costly itself.

However faced with competition a larger amount shifts out of the workplace. The population percentage recieving disability pensions has doubled over the last 25 years, this spiked during the great recession. In other words, there is a reason the US is starting to have trailor parks en mass.

Recent statistics in the United States showed that the likelyhood that a person was to vote for Trump correlated with their death rate. in other words the reason why people are attracted to Trump is economic despair.

I did comment on it, I have a good income, my mps is rather good n relation to mpc, and the cost of living is anything but static.

Reluctantly, they're hedging their bets.

I must say I'm rather perturbed to see these accusations of "white knight" or white supremacist being tossed around. I understand that this is used routinely by the far left to smear and discredit people who hold contrary viewpoints[/B], but I've never actually encountered it before. Now I know how Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins feel.

It should be noted that I live not in Idaho, but Vancouver one of the most culturally & racially diverse cities in North America, quite frankly I never grew up in one of those suburbia's where the population was 90% white, so I can't really relate to the were being taken over fear, I'm quite content living culturally diverse population and would not have it any other way ,but I do have deep economic concerns when it comes to free trade and mass immigration.

Perhaps it is because I grew up in working class ground zero, and your of a middle class background that causes the difference in persepctives, so let me tell you a few things.

* My stepdad lost his good paying job, because the business was sold and outsourced to people who hired immigrants that were willing to work for $14 dollars an hour, rather than $22. He got retrained but he's too old to get hired, he's most likely going to have a reduced life expectancy when his money runs out, and I'm sure I'll supporting my folks for awhile.

* The same thing happened to a good friend of my moms, but in this case they were skilled labourers on a printing press.

* I was forced back into school because the plastic making plant I was working on shut down and went....yes you guessed it, to Mexico. Turns out their cheaper labour than Canadians.

* A good family friend of ours lost their job at the mill after 20 years, because the company decided it was cheaper just to ship raw logs into the States. He's now stuck working for a temp labour company.

* My older cousin lost his job at a union plant do to layoffs, so now scratches by as a real estate agent.

and it goes on and on and f'n on. So the working class salutes you

KyleDaCosta

I wasn't planning on my first comment being about politics on this forum. Nevertheless, here it goes. I don't get why people want to associate themselves with Donald Trump. You're just exposing your lack of intelligence by doing so. Sure, he's charismatic, entertaining and fun to listen to. It stops there, though. I mean this guy could be making the most important decisions in our country for four entire years. People need to seriously consider that.

Even looking past him being a racist, sexist and xenophobic fear-mongerer -- he has zero relevant experience, or any clue about foreign policy or international relations. He doesn't even have ideas. He just states what he will do in the most elementary ways. He wants to replace ObamaCare, for example, yet he has no alternative tax plan. In addition, he has already pissed off some of America's biggest allies, and he's JUST a candidate. So, just imagine what he will do if he's president. His plan to build a wall in Mexico is financially unfeasible on top of absurd, too. A lot of immigrants aren't even jumping over walls. They're digging tunnels.

I cannot think of one idea he brings to the table that is well-rounded, well-thought-out or remotely realistic, and any supporter of him HAS to like him for his personality. In no way, shape or form anyone who has even a small understanding of politics would want him near the White House.

Chula Vista

Yes, yes, and yes. Although he does have a good plan about replacing Obamacare. To quote the man himself:

"We're going to repeal Obamacare and replace it with something great!"

DELIRIOUS CROWD GOES CRAZY!!!!!

And WTB, the working middle class is made up of immigrants, or the children of immigrants, or the grandchildren of immigrants. You mention that the plastics plant you worked at moved to Mexico as if it's Mexico or Mexicans fault. Instead it was the greedy owners (most likely white) who didn't give a **** about you workers and just wanted to increase their bottom line.

From the outside looking in you definitely come across as a bit racist and anti-liberal for all the wrong reasons. Bet you $100 the owners of the plastics plant were members of the GOP party. Or should I say the greed party when it comes to business.

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“The fact that we live at the bottom of a deep gravity well,
on the surface of a gas covered planet going around a nuclear fireball 90 million miles away
and think this to be normal is obviously some indication of how skewed our perspective tends to be.”

Frownland

Greed knows no political affiliation, Chula, that's just dumb.

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Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth.