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-   -   What Did President Trump Do Now? (https://www.musicbanter.com/current-events-philosophy-religion/87986-what-did-president-trump-do-now.html)

Janszoon 02-01-2017 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anteater (Post 1802151)
Does the U.S. have some Christian equivalent of Sharia law that's commonplace? Come on now.

Did I say it did?

Anteater 02-01-2017 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1802152)
Did I say it did?

I'll ask this another way. Is getting thrown off a roof for being gay a systemic problem in U.S. culture?

Janszoon 02-01-2017 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anteater (Post 1802153)
I'll ask this another way. Is getting thrown off a roof for being gay a systemic problem in the U.S. ?

Nope. But that's a markedly different statement than, "If they were a modern Christian nation nobody would be getting thrown off buildings. Period."

Neapolitan 02-01-2017 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anteater (Post 1802148)
Saudi Arabia has plenty of money and power, but their society is only as rigidly structured as it is because of how they interpret Islam. If they were a modern Christian nation nobody would be getting thrown off buildings. Period.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1802149)
Yeah, no one has ever been thrown off a building in a Christian nation. Amazing argument.

I don't know if there are any Christian nations left, but in the rest of the civilized world (use that term loosely) if someone throws someone off a building it's a crime. Even if that person represents the law or is sworn to uphold the law, even a police officer it's a crime. No way around it. If a cop did it there would be an investigation, an internal investigation, a state investigation, and possibly a federal investigation to see if the victim's civil rights were violated. No one in their right mind would consider it justice. Not in the press, not in the courts, no where.

However in sharia law it is that law that allows them to throw them off a building.

Chula Vista 02-01-2017 11:27 PM

Just plain naive logic.

In other news, Trump pisses off Australia:

Trump has heated exchange with Australian leader, sources say - CNNPolitics.com

Janszoon 02-01-2017 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neapolitan (Post 1802172)
I don't know if there are any Christian nations left...

Hilarious. Thanks for the yuks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neapolitan (Post 1802172)
...but in the rest of the civilized world (use that term loosely) if someone throws someone off a building it's a crime. Even if that person represents the law or is sworn to uphold the law, even a police officer it's a crime. No way around it. If a cop did it there would be an investigation, an internal investigation, a state investigation, and possibly a federal investigation to see if the victim's civil rights were violated. No one in their right mind would consider it justice. Not in the press, not in the courts, no where.

However in sharia law it is that law that allows them to throw them off a building.

And?

Neapolitan 02-01-2017 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chula Vista (Post 1802175)
Just plain naive logic.

In other news, Trump pisses off Australia:

Trump has heated exchange with Australian leader, sources say - CNNPolitics.com

Quote:

At the heart of the weekend conversation between Mr. Trump and Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull was a deal struck with the Obama administration that would allow mostly Muslim refugees rejected by Australia to be resettled in the United States. Report: Trump, Australian PM Turnbull have tense phone call over Muslim refugees - CBS News
So it's OK for Australia to reject the refugees, permanently I take it, but it's not OK to temporarily suspend citizens' travel from seven countries?

Chula Vista 02-01-2017 11:52 PM

Quote:

Turnbull declined to comment on reports in The Washington Post that the president had described the agreement as “the worst deal ever” and accused Turnbull of seeking to export the “next Boston bombers.”
Feeding the paranoia and fear. Thumbs up Donald.

Chula Vista 02-02-2017 12:54 AM

Good lord. Samantha Bee is tearing the **** out of Trump brilliantly right now on the tube. Half comedy and half total truth. I love her.

An older bit:


riseagainstrocks 02-02-2017 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anteater (Post 1802035)
One minor point: Christianity, rationally speaking, doesn't relate much back to anything in the Old Testament since it predates Jesus's birth. The Qur'an is a different story: Mohammad and his life is the ultimate ideal, not Jesus's. That's where you start seeing fundamental differences in ideology.

Matthew 5:17 [Jesus speaking]

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."

This is an old argument and unfortunately is not one I think holds much water. But it's actually illustrative of the larger point, that the overwhelming majority of religious people are not slavishly devoted to every word in their holy book. Part of the reason I'm not religious is the cognitive dissonance displayed there. It's either written/directly revealed by God or it's not.

Regardless, the majority of the alt-right's claims regarding Islam are provably false. And the ones that aren't (invocations to kill nonbelievers, the superiority of Islam over other faiths, Islamic eschatology) are found in Christianity. Since most alt-right proponents were raised as Christians or at least have been exposed to the faith and it's adherents their whole life, they intuitively understand that following a religion doesn't mean you follow all of that religion.

Some strong analogies in this thread. elphenor's 'faith as clothing' idea is quite accurate for, what I would very unscientifically estimate, 90% of 'believers'. And yes, TheBatlord, a pair of tennis shoes never motivated a suicide bomber. But as myself and others stated earlier, religious violence is most commonly used by people manipulated by those with aspirations for earthly power. Faith is a powerful motivator, but it's hard to directly tie it to violence. As you said, the WBC doesn't engage in mass murder, despite holding the same level of contempt and hatred for the majority of Americans (homosexuals and homosexual allies). Jihadists and WBC/Identitarians/Sovereign Citizens share the similar mindsets; ones easier to turn against their fellow humans. But, with few exceptions, the critical conditions for terrorist action aren't common in the West.

To reiterate, poverty, lack of cultural diffusion, lack of empowerment, and lack of opportunity create the ground for terrorists. It takes emotional manipulation to make a 17 year old shepherd strap a bomb to his chest and kill dozens of his neighbors. Religion is arguably the most powerful emotional impetus; a fact well known by the sadistic nihilists that lead ISIS, al Qaeda, etc.


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