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elphenor 02-01-2017 06:57 PM

A set of beliefs doesn't follow by saying I'm a follower of Christ aka a Christian

Indeed most Americans are both Christians and entirely unchristlike

Where as if I tell you I'm a Marxist but think Bill Gates should remain a billionaire I'm just lying/being inconsistent

The Batlord 02-01-2017 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1802124)
A set of beliefs doesn't follow by saying I'm a follower of Christ aka a Christian

Indeed most Americans are both Christians and entirely unchristlike

wut? Please answer the question cause I don't even know what your "answer" means. What separates a religion from an ideology? Keep in mind that your answer will necessarily require more than a snarky sentence or two.

elphenor 02-01-2017 07:09 PM

I'm not sure how to make it more plain

Have you heard of the Not a True Scotsman fallacy?

Edit: er No true Scotsman? Believe that's how it's usually said actually

DwnWthVwls 02-01-2017 07:21 PM

If I understand your argument correctly it sounds like you're using it, not Batlord... No "true christian" would act unchristlike.

The Batlord 02-01-2017 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1802126)
I'm not sure how to make it more plain

Have you heard of the Not a True Scotsman fallacy?

Edit: er No true Scotsman? Believe that's how it's usually said actually

Every atheist on the internet knows what that is. Please apply that in an argument. Cause I assure you, you are not being plain.

elphenor 02-01-2017 07:29 PM

How dooes one get that from a sentence where I declare they are both unchristlike AND Christians

Put another way The Bible says what you want it to say you get out of it what you came for

If you came for a justification for violence it's in there

If you came for ways to be more tolerant and peaceful it's in there too

elphenor 02-01-2017 07:34 PM

The Bible never "saved" anyone they made that decision prior to picking up the book

Historically witch hunts didn't happen because of Christianity indeed witch phobia in in the bible because it was already a superstition

The Batlord 02-01-2017 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1802130)
How dooes one get that from a sentence where I declare they are both unchristlike AND Christians

Put another way The Bible says what you want it to say you get out of it what you came for

If you came for a justification for violence it's in there

If you came for ways to be more tolerant and peaceful it's in there too

I'm just gonna assume you're saying that there's bad **** in the Bible too (cause you sound like you're trying to debate on acid, please clean up your attempts at arguing) and I've been saying this whole time that I don't ****ing like any religions. I'm not arguing the position that Islam is terrible and Christianity is the bomb. I think that all religions are based on nonsense, and most if not all of them are very susceptible to violence. Islam is not immune from that just because so many Republicans are prejudiced *******s. Cultural conservatism's intolerance of non-Christian religions is a non-sequitur regarding Islam's ****tiness or non-****tiness.

elphenor 02-01-2017 07:44 PM

And I'm agreeing that it's nonsense

But it's irrelevant nonsense same as the way we pick what style tennis shoes to wear

The Batlord 02-01-2017 07:56 PM

Except that tennis shoes do not have dogma, either scriptural or cultural, that guides the actions of their wearers. I'm honestly not sure how to proceed from here because we're just talking about really basic ****. The shoes you wear do not affect how you see the world. The god you worship can and often does. No pair of Nikes has ever inspired or even been used as a spurious justification for an atrocity. Religion and Islam have. I think you've oversimplified your argument to the point that you don't even have one.

I'm not even arguing that Islam is this great evil compared to other ideologies and religions, I simply think it's dumb to dismiss it as irrelevant as so many people try to do. It's an incredibly powerful force in the lives of millions of people, many of whom use it as a pretext for violence, and whether the specific words of the Quran have caused this violence is in fact irrelevant, because these people have still derived meaning from the texts of Islam that has at the very least justified their actions in their own minds.

Whatever the specifics of the relationship between Islam and Islamic terrorists, to pretend that there is no problem in modern Islam in any way is retarded.


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