DwnWthVwls

Since when? Half of this thread is about the current state of mainstream hiphop and how it is degrading to the black community. I'm telling you an outlet does exist for people to not pimp themselves to the corporate music industry but it's not as lucrative therefore it's not as appealing. If that's not relevant to this discussion I don't know what is.

It evolved to what it is today because that's what is appealing to the people who contribute the most to record sales. It's not a race thing it's a taste thing.

How could something with origins in the west be westernized? Corporatized? sure. Westernized? no.

My definition of westernizing is when western ideology/culture is forced upon or purposefully absorbed by another culture. China opening McDonalds/Starbucks is an example of westernization, not inner city black people selling out to corporate white men to have a chance at success and helping their family.

No I can not. That is an observation I have made after following the underground scene for the past 10 years. Just go on youtube and look for yourself. I attribute it to the fact that white kids are more privileged in this country so if they try and fail it doesn't have nearly the impact it would for minorities.

Can you find me stats proving otherwise? I don't think this is a topic fit for statistical analysis by anyone savvy enough to do it.

Black people have been depicted negatively in the media since this country was founded and it has nothing to do with hiphop. Racism still runs rampant.

Regardless of that fact this is more about classicism than race. The people you are talking about who are abusing black culture would do the same thing to any other race/person to make a dollar. Have you seen/heard Iggy Azalia? The difference is the inner city black community is the most susceptible because poor living conditions make for easy exploitation.


I know you don't know me very well (vice versa) but I can almost guarantee that no one is more on your side, when it comes to the current state of hiphop, than me. However, you are going about this the wrong way.

Edit: On a side not, their is ZERO I repeat ZERO correlation between skin color and ability the ability to educate. That point you made about your professor feels like you forcing race on an issue that has nothing to do with it.

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I don't got a god complex, you got a simple god...

CoNtrivedNiHilism

Good grief...

You know what? I've tried multiple times pointing out what you're doing. So I will let someone else try where I have failed.

And you better watch yourself when you say something like "typical white privileged nonsense"...because that will piss off more than just me. Oh my god. I just want to go off on you so bad for that little statement of yours. Lady. You're asking for it.

Soulflower

I am going to pray for you

Because I could have called you ALOT of things after all the ignorant name calling you did towards me... but didnt.


What pisses me off are white people who act like racism does not exist anymore when it in fact does and who act like they are not apart of the problem when it comes to issues such as this when they very much are. That is acting on your privileged by "ignoring" your race is apart of the problem.

Where are your facts?

Where is the information you collected that proved my responses wrong?

You insist on complaining about my opinion instead of intelligently supporting why you disagree.

CoNtrivedNiHilism

I am well aware that racism is still a problem. I witness it every single day at work. And it pisses me off. Racism is wrong, so wrong. I'm ignoring my race is part of the problem? My race, your race, Mexicans, Japanese, racism can and does come from every single ethnicity! It is not just white culture that throws it around, so please stop trying to convince me that the majority of it comes from us!

And where I disagree, by the way, is in your approach to this entire conversation with you.

DwnWthVwls

@Soul - When this little flame war is over I'd appreciate it if you addressed my points.

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I don't got a god complex, you got a simple god...

CoNtrivedNiHilism

I would hope you see why I'm so frustrated with her haha. I am only trying to help her see how she is making herself look. But I am failing.

Soulflower

We are discussing the changes in current mainstream rap music, yes BUT we haven't really discussed rappers and MC's who are still trying to keep real Hip Hop music alive. You were the first person to actually bring that point up. It is not mentioned at all before your post.

I already specified when this was addressed to me earlier that I was only speaking on the mainstream rap music. I never implied Hip Hop didn't exist anymore.


It evolved to what it is today because it was stripped from its culture to be more appealing to a wider audience and to have cross over appeal. It was changed so it could appeal more to white people.

This has everything to do with race.


Because it was not created by westernize principles. It was created by African Americans and the African American experience.

Once the record labels and Corporations got their hands on it, they changed it so it could have cross over appeal and appeal to more people. I don't see how you can not see once something is changed it is being stripped of its original form.


Its more to it besides just that specifically. The corporations now control the type of lyrics and production that is formed on these songs. They control the image and the direction of these rap music videos. They control how these songs and rappers are marketed. The way they are commercialized is very influenced by the western culture.

Bling Bling, Rims, Half naked women, Alot of money is not really an accurate reflection of "Hip Hop" but its a artificial fantasy that sells to a wider audience.

For instance, rapping about innocent black kids getting shot in the ghettos by crooked cops does not sell to a wide audience. When NWA tried to do it, they got banned and it stirred a lot of controversy.


I agree that there are talented white MC's trying to keep hip hop alive but I disagree with you insisting them being the bigger percentage compared to minorities in Hip Hop. That is just an exaggeration.


AGREE.

I really appreciate you saying this. I hope CoNtrivedNiHilism saw this.


AGREE and thanks because I was beginning think most here were racist and did not want to acknowledge this fact.


This has to do with race as well love.

Classicism exists because of racism ESPECIALLY for African Americans.

It has ALWAYS been that way and it will continue to for that very reason.



I really appreciate your responses and I really appreciate the fact that you maintained respect and did not revert to name calling which you could have easily done. I am not handling this topic wrong.

I was not implying that it did. I don't think it does either.

I mentioned it to show that there are a lot of white people who feel the same way as I do about this topic and racism in America overall.

So it is not just minorities who feel this way.

Soulflower

Yes you are, because you keep insisting I am blaming white people for something that they did.

I am not putting the blame on anybody because this is an actual fact . Those white record labels and corporations changed hip hop so it could appeal more to white people and you have consistently called me a racist this entire time just for saying the truth.

Any old school Hip Hop act Krs One, Sugar Hill Gang, Public Enemy etc have said the same thing.

CoNtrivedNiHilism

Well. When you said it was typical white privileged nonsense. It pissed me off. I didn't say that I did not think or agree that whites or more privileged. Because the simple fact is that we are. It was how you said it that didn't sit well with me.

Something else is that if we could have discussed this topic in a better way. I would have eventually said in my own words, what DwnWthVwls said about blacks being depicted negatively in the media.

And I do hope you're not implying that you think I'm racist. Because one of my best friends I've known since I was 16 is black, I also have a close friend of mine I met at a college who is black. I've nothing but love for black culture. But I won't act like how you handled yourself in our exchange didn't piss me off. Because it did. The least you can do is acknowledge that and apologize. I am more than willing to apologize to you as well.

Soulflower

You have not ONCE acknowledged that white people are apart of the problem
You never acknowledged racism and when I tried to point it out you called me racist. That is why I called your post typical white privileged nonsense because you ignored these facts throughout the discussion.

I am not apologizing to you because I didn't do you anything to you.

YOU on the other hand have called me a racist and personally attacked me and I handled your posts with maturity despite your disrespect.

When you sincerely want to apologize to someone..... you just do it, you don't ask for expecting an apology in return. If that is what you are looking for than I just rather you not apologize at all.