JGuy Grungeman

As a huge fan of Meat Loaf and a man who happens to have read part of the actual ROCK OPERA script and happens to know that the majority of the songs, if not all of them, area part of that STORY, I can tell a guy who hasn't even studied it that it's a rock opera, if not a soundtrack to a rock opera. You shouldn't say "it's not" and then end the point. That's no discussion. And it was acted out on stage multiple times before the album was made, and Jim Steinman is planning on bringing it back.

Bat Out of Hell is more than a rock opera to me. Before Meat Loaf, music was just some hobby and I wasn't too serious about it. I wasn't sure who my favorite band was. It switched a lot. After Bat Out of Hell and Hysteria, I joined music forums and discovered many new forms of music. It was because of those albums that I gained interest in finding greater albums. I gained love for rock operas. So please forgive me if I seem rude or butthurt, but taking the album off that list is similar to telling me I can't see the most important album in my life on a rock survivor thread. I know that wasn't your intention.

I have seen many websites and lists cite Meat Loaf as a rock opera, and that's just from three years. That is because I have been studying the album's history for writing articles.

And it has everything to do because Meat Loaf is far more an icon of rock than Jeff Wayne. At least Bat Out of Hell has stood the test of time enough for people today put it in their rock opera, 70's, hard rock lists when I have never seen Jeff Wayne in a list. And I used to go to a site where there was nothnig but lists and a forum. And I visited a lot of rock lists for recommendations. I really don't feel that Jeff Wayne is as important in the rock industry as Meat Loaf, especially since he has done a duet with one of the most famous people ever: CHER. Even if Cher sucks in some people's eyes, that's freakin' impressive.

The point was that he is an icon. Jeff Wayne was a one hit wonder. Meat Loaf had three hit albums and at least ten hit singles going from the 70's to 90s. I'm not saying Wayne can not be on since there are plenty of one-hit wonders. And if you like the album more, I'm fine with that. I don't mind replacing ANATO, since it's not really a rock opera. I included it because I've also seen plenty of people call that a rock opera, even some official critics. I'll admit, I don't think it is since there is no story whatsoever. I think it has rock opera influecnes but when push comes to shove it's the least deserving rock opera album to get that title. So, can we replace Queen II with ANATO?

But if you want to disagree, please don't sound so stern about it. I admit, I started it. And I apologize for any rude things I may have said or for causing discomfort for anyone. But it comes as a shock when an album like Bat gets kicked off smt.



Now, I condense many topics into one post to keep myself from flooding threads with this last statement... are we going to have a screamo ten?

The Batlord

Importance is irrelevant. Occasionally I've tried keeping in an album in my thread due to it's historical relevance, but it's just a sop that keeps out a better album. Not saying BOOH doesn't deserve a place on this or another list, but importance should have no place in its inclusion.

And just because you are so hellbent on an album's inclusion doesn't mean we all have to bow to your whims. This isn't your thread, nor do you have a bigger vote than anyone else. If your fav album doesn't get included then just deal with it.

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JGuy Grungeman

Excuse me, but how can this be a rock album survivor if the third highest selling rock album in the world isn't on? This thread has been about importance. Plenty of discussions on this thread have been about how much more important one album is compared to others. Importance is not irrelevant. And I already apologized for my rude behavior. But if you want me to be rude, I'll be happy to do so. If you don't want me to be rude, then zip it. You don't have to get worked up after I just apologized for my behavior, or is the only reason you're saying it that way to be the ass you are so glad to be, being proud of you're trollish tendencies?

That discussion is over. Trollheart has stated he's done arguing, and I've stated that we should leave both on and take another album off. ANd not to be pretentious, but I have contributed eight lists here, so I'd like just one choice on what album stays. I'm not saying I'm more improtant than anyone here. I doubt I'm allowed to post my music in a sig (I don't have any recorded music, anyway). But Technic's been very easygoing about switching albums around, and I was quite a bit agitated when I shouldn't have been. However, you were just being rude to me right after I apologized. That doesn't make me the bad guy here when you were just trying to be. I want one album on. One album shouldn't garner that reaction from you as much as it should've made me agitated. I admitted my flaws, so Batlord, back off.

Now can I please, freakin' talk about something else? I'd like to see a screamo one here. I just found today I like screamo, but I have next to nothing on it. All I know is "The Moon Is a Dead World."

Tristan_Geoff

Screamo

Gospel- The Moon is a Dead World
Orchid- Dance Tonight, Revolution Tomorrow
Pageninetynine- Document #8
Antioch Arrow- The Lady is a Cat
Heroin- All About Heroin
Circle Takes the Square- As the Roots Undo
Men as Trees- Weltschmerz
City of Caterpillar- City of Caterpillar
Touche Amore- To the Beat of a Dead Horse
Loma Prieta- IV

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Tristan_Geoff

Oops, just realized that Cap'n Jazz is on the post-hardcore list too. Trade out Cap'n Jazz for Get Up Kid's Four Minute Mile on Emo when you can, Tech.

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The Batlord

And when it comes time to vote, people are going to vote for the album they like better, so what's the point of putting up an album they probably won't like as much? Why not just include the album that's gonna stand the better chance of winning in the first place? If other albums before this one have been included because of historical importance then they shouldn't have been.

I could give a **** about you being rude, but as someone who's been running a survivor thread for a year it's annoying to see someone feel entitled in such a childish manner. Over one freakin' album. If I were running this thread I'd have been strongly tempted to have thrown it out just for spite.

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grindy

Simmer down, buds.

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Unknown Soldier

Journey yes but Boston are liked by loads of people that can't stand AOR, so using them as an 'I like AOR reference' doesn't count. Now when you start to get all hot and excited over a Toto album then I'll think of you as a AOR bro.

Especially when the album is a Meat Loaf one. Not much of a Meat Loaf fan but Bat probably does deserve to be in a cat and rock opera is the best, as the whole album is like a parody of one.

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Trollheart

Just so you know, do what you want as I say with Bat out of Hell but please stop putting down Wayne. That album celebrated its 30th anniversary in 2008 and went back on tour; the ticket sales were huge. People remembered it from their childhood/growing up. It was so popular that a new version was recorded in 2012 with a younger cast, and prior to that it had been re-released and remixed loads of times. It's a very popular album and very unique. Nobody to my knowledge had before taken a well-known story and made it into a rock opera (unless you count the likes of Jesus Christ Superstar; well let's say a novel) so it was something totally new at the time. The stars that played on it --- Richard Burton, Phil Lynott, David Essex etc --- make it one of the most important albums of its time, and if you had been living/interested in music in 1978 you certainly would have heard about it. It also spawned a top ten hit in the UK and is one of the biggest selling albums of all time in the UK.

It definitely deserves a place. For my money, albums like The Wall, Tommy, should be there. But now that I look at the list, aren't you mixing up rock operas with concept albums? 2112? The Lamb? I know the latter was slated to be made into a movie, but that's not a rock opera either. Concept album does not equal rock opera. Also, Quadrophenia over Tommy? You serious???

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Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

Unknown Soldier

Rock Operas and concept albums have been mixed up, again should be two cats.

As there are so many cats at the moment, I don't think any extra cats are going to be a problem.

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