NBA thread

[Wpnfire]

Originally Posted by realtalk92

Please do not compare Lebron James to Michael Legendary Jordan.

and Lebron is DEFINITLY not Jordan.

Period

I literally have no idea how or why you thought I was comparing the two. I was dismissing the notion that the shot from Ray Allen in game 6 was a once in a lifetime shot, it's just not. I agree it's very rare, but there have been a few others like it, "The Shot" for one-which is why I brought up Jordan.

Miami relies heavily on James, Wade and Bosh to score for most of their points.

This statement right here is COMPLETELY irrelevant to this discussion. This is called appealing to emotion and that's a logical fallacy. The Bulls relied heavily on Jordan until Pippen showed up, so what the hell difference does it make where a team gets their scoring from??
This statement is just that...just a statement that serves no other purpose than to make people angry about the Heat.

And you know what else?

Miami did not have to play a really hard team to get to the Finals.

This statement is the exact same emotional appeal bull**** as the above statement. The lack of good teams in the Eastern Conference outside of the Pacers, Heat, and maybe the Hawks has absolutely nothing to do with how good the Heat are. I don't know how you think this is relevant but it's just not relevant at all.

Originally Posted by realtalk92

The Spurs had to play against a possesed electric Wesbrooke and a future Hall of Famer Durant to get to the Fianls. Miami is NO where on that level lol

here's 5 random articles that support Chris Bosh, Dwyane Wade, LeBron, and Allen as future Hall of Famer's.


NBA & ABA Leaders and Records for Hall of Fame Probability | Basketball-Reference.com
Predicting Which Current NBA Stars Will Make the Hall of Fame | Bleacher Report
NBA: Top 20 Active Players with Best Chances of Making Hall of Fame | SPORTS LIST OF THE DAY
Chris Bosh among 18 active players likely to make Hall - NBA - Ian Thomsen - SI.com
20 Current NBA Players Bound For The Hall of Fame | The Hoop Doctors

That link from Bleacher Report is two-years old-You got that? When Bosh was 28 he was still talented enough to be considered HOF material.

The most important of those links is the first one, which lists the probability of every player in the league for getting into the Hall of Fame based on certain criteria that is aggregated to a single percentage. Here's a list for the Heat players if you don't want to find them out individually:

Dwayne Wade: 99% probability
LeBron James: 99% probability
Chris Bosh: 96% probability
Ray Allen: 94% probability


For comparison, here are the Spurs..
Tim Duncan 99% probability
Tony Parker 89% probability
Manu Ginobili 12% probability

Also, here's something another member said about the Heat..

Originally Posted by YorkeDaddy

Here's some plain old stats for you:

Player A Career Stats:
13.3 ppg, 10.5 rpg, 3.4 assists, 0.8 steals, 2.2 blocks

Player A Awards and Accomplishments:
2x NBA Champion
1x NBA Finals MVP
1x NBA MVP
2x All Star


Player B Career Stats:
19.3 ppg, 8.8 rpg, 2.0 assists, 0.8 steals, 1.1 blocks

Player B Awards and Accomplishments:
2x NBA Champion
8x All Star

Player A is Bill Walton. He was a shoo-in for the Hall of Fame. Player B, who has very similar stats, is Chris Bosh.

Despite your (unfounded) belief that the Spurs are superior to the Heat talent wise, the Heat undisputedly have 4 HOF-caliber players on their team, and the Spurs really only have 2 for sure (Ginobili is on fence for the Hall of Fame depending on who you talk to.)

[Soulflower]

Originally Posted by Rezdaddy Longlegs

Realtalk you seriously should watch more basketball before you actually comment on it. Your opinion means nothing if based off nothing.

Neither does yours if you can't express what it is you disagree with.

Saying "you don't know anything about basketball" expresses nothing and is rather immature if you ask me.

I never came in here and said "I know everything about basketball". I even insisted that I didn't watch all the games in between Miami and Indiana.

I am just simply stating MY opinion and perspectives.

I might not be a basketball guru but I know enough and watch enough of it to form an opinion which I am entitled to have.

[Paul Smeenus]

^ even though I'm mainly an NHL fan I will dispute the relevance of counting HOF candidates. The Spurs primarily win with smothering team defense ala 1988-1990 Pistons. That team only had 1 HOF'er (Isaiah Thomas, Dumars would be on the fence) yet won titles.

I think this series will go seven. I hate to say it but realtalk has me rooting for Miami (to the nominal degree that I care). I do think the Spurs are the only team that can beat the Heat, so it could go either way.

LeBron haters need to get over the damn press conference.

[Wpnfire]

Originally Posted by Paul Smeenus

^ even though I'm mainly an NHL fan I will dispute the relevance of counting HOF candidates. The Spurs primarily win with smothering team defense ala 1988-1990 Pistons. That team only had 1 HOF'er (Isaiah Thomas, Dumars would be on the fence) yet won titles.

Yeah but defense isn't particularly accolade worthy hence why defensive-oriented players rarely are inducted into the hall of fame. And don't get me wrong, I do not mean to be use the HOF candidates as the end-all of team caliber, but a player's high-HOF likelihood is usually at least a moderately good indicator of a player's talent.


Also, to go into more detail, Chris Bosh was the face of the Toronto franchise for 7 years before he came to Miami. Someone like Ginobili may be able to claim at least part of the face of the Spurs franchise, but not in the same way Bosh can for Toronto. When you think of the Spurs, you usually associate it with Duncan for the most part, especially at the defensive end.

[FRED HALE SR.]

Originally Posted by Wpnfire

Yeah but defense isn't particularly accolade worthy hence why defensive-oriented players rarely are inducted into the hall of fame. And don't get me wrong, I do not mean to be use the HOF candidates as the end-all of team caliber, but a player's high-HOF likelihood is usually at least a moderately good indicator of a player's talent.


Also, to go into more detail, Chris Bosh was the face of the Toronto franchise for 7 years before he came to Miami. Someone like Ginobili may be able to claim at least part of the face of the Spurs franchise, but not in the same way Bosh can for Toronto, or in the same way Duncan can for the Spurs.

Part of Ginobli's greatness is tied to his ability to rise up and play his best in the playoffs. Hes certainly streaky, but i'd say hes hall of fame caliber, but is currently short on numbers. Tim Duncan will always be the face of the franchise til he retires. Bosh has a few more years to earn his credentials also in my eyes, but is certainly talented enough. I give the nod in coaching to Pop, which is why i believe it goes seven.

[Dr_Rez]

Originally Posted by realtalk92

Neither does yours if you can't express what it is you disagree with.

Saying "you don't know anything about basketball" expresses nothing and is rather immature if you ask me.

I never came in here and said "I know everything about basketball". I even insisted that I didn't watch all the games in between Miami and Indiana.

I am just simply stating MY opinion and perspectives.

I might not be a basketball guru but I know enough and watch enough of it to form an opinion which I am entitled to have.

Originally Posted by realtalk92

LOL

To be fair I actually did not watch the net series but I was told by a few that they barely beat them and from viewing past series that is a Miami track record.

You said that after being called out for talking about what happened in a series you didn't even watch. That is just one example of you talking out of your ass.

Also WPNfire just explained for me why almost every point you made on the last few pages is garbage,.

[Soulflower]

Okay I realized I wrote that.

I did watch some of the games in that series though but I did not watch the entire series like I normally would have. I don't even know if I want to watch the game Thursday. I am scared to watch it. After that mess that went down over last summer I vowed to never watch the NBA ever again. Seriously. I get to emotional lol!


I am interested in hearing some of your opinions since you know "so much" about basketball.

Also just because someone did not watch every game in a series does not mean they know nothing about basketball. You still have yet to support your opinion.

[Wpnfire]

Originally Posted by FRED HALE SR.

Part of Ginobli's greatness is tied to his ability to rise up and play his best in the playoffs. Hes certainly streaky, but i'd say hes hall of fame caliber, but is currently short on numbers. Tim Duncan will always be the face of the franchise til he retires. Bosh has a few more years to earn his credentials also in my eyes, but is certainly talented enough. I give the nod in coaching to Pop, which is why i believe it goes seven.

I agree with you about Ginobili playing out of his mind in the playoffs. Just in this past OKC series after Ibaka came back, Ginobili suddenly appeared from nowhere, like in game 3 when he made 6/9 on his threes including 5 in a row and one in particular from like 6 feet beyond the arc at the end of the first half-that was simply ridiculous.

[Paul Smeenus]

Originally Posted by realtalk92

Okay I realized I wrote that.

I did watch some of the games in that series though but I did not watch the entire series like I normally would have. I don't even know if I want to watch the game Thursday. I am scared to watch it. After that mess that went down over last summer I vowed to never watch the NBA ever again. Seriously. I get to emotional lol!


I am interested in hearing some of your opinions since you know "so much" about basketball.

Also just because someone did not watch every game in a series does not mean they know nothing about basketball. You still have yet to support your opinion.

I think I can clarify.

We think you have no objectivity whatsoever when the discussion involves the Miami Heat. We think you, and likely the people around you from what you've posted here, just hate LBJ and can't or won't get over the press conference (which was revolting but hey, let's move on). We think that you are exposing yourself as nonobjective as hell when you make statements that Miami "just barely" beat Brooklyn (as if that matters) when the Heat beat 'em 4 games to 1, two of those 4 wins being by double digits and one of them a complete and total massacre (again, as if that matters). We think you're letting your Heat-hating flag fly by calling Ray Allen (a fantastic player for years in Seattle and Boston before joining the Heat) "lucky" when he in fact, caught the pass, stepped behind the three point line, squared up and cold-blooded NAILED that three pointer.

You want lucky shots? Here's TWO of them back to back, one of them by the great Tim Duncan



Let's all complain about that.

[Wpnfire]

Originally Posted by Paul Smeenus

I think I can clarify.

We think you have no objectivity whatsoever when the discussion involves the Miami Heat. We think you, and likely the people around you from what you've posted here, just hate LBJ and can't or won't get over the press conference (which was revolting but hey, let's move on). We think that you are exposing yourself as nonobjective as hell when you make statements that Miami "just barely" beat Brooklyn (as if that matters) when the Heat beat 'em 4 games to 1, two of those 4 wins being by double digits and one of them a complete and total massacre (again, as if that matters). We think you're letting your Heat-hating flag fly by calling Ray Allen (a fantastic player for years in Seattle and Boston before joining the Heat) "lucky" when he in fact, caught the pass, stepped behind the three point line, squared up and cold-blooded NAILED that three pointer.

You want lucky shots? Here's TWO of them back to back, one of them by the great Tim Duncan



Let's all complain about that.

*standing ovation*