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elphenor 01-12-2017 12:30 PM

you have a child's understanding of how Capitalism distributes wealth

but it's also worth mentioning it simply wouldn't work any other way but a progressive tax code unless you want to look like a third world country

income disparity is so large than in order to raise enough money through a flat tax to just pay for our police and military and roads and public school you'd have to tax the middle class like 50% of their income

duga 01-12-2017 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goofle (Post 1794523)
You can't just say words. Explain to me why it's perfectly reasonable to take more money off wealthy people?

Ok, I'll spell it out more clearly then. You have a right to your personal freedoms, but living in this country and enjoying the myriad benefits that you have that many others do not is not free. It is not a right. It is a privilege. It takes money to sustain the infrastructure needed to actually keep the free market going. Does it make sense that the poorest of our country are the ones sustaining this market? Wouldn't it make more sense if the highest earners, having earned their wealth in said system, put more back into this system to make it bigger and better than before? Even Republicans agree with this. The thing is - they thought trickle down would be the solution. IT'S NOT. Do you have another solution other than more taxes? If so, let's hear it. The past 3 decades have shown us that rather than playing their part and paying their fair share into this system that made them rich, they'd rather cut and run. Would it be great if we could live in a world where everyone just recognized what they need to do and paid their fair share? Of course. But for every good person out there, there's an ass hole waiting to take advantage. And because of those ass holes, the only way to fix the economy is to tax the rich.

These aren't just words. Contributing to the system that makes your life so good is a RESPONSIBILITY. One that the poor have no choice over and one that the rich are constantly trying to get out of.

elphenor 01-12-2017 12:36 PM

I don't think I could convince Goofle that it's "fair" but it's undeniably necessary to have a progressive tax code

Without one our economy can't even work as the middle class is an entirely artificial construct

progressive tax codes are the only reason capitalism doesn't exist in its natural 2 class state of have and have nots

Chula Vista 01-12-2017 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goofle (Post 1794518)
And I'll concede that I don't understand the exact tax process.

Yet this doesn't prohibit you from making silly statements about it? Ok.

Chula Vista 01-12-2017 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duga (Post 1794538)
But for every good person out there, there's an ass hole waiting to take advantage. And because of those ass holes, the only way to fix the economy is to tax the rich.

*cough* Trump *cough*

The other thing is that the wealthy have the means to find loopholes so that they do not have to pay their fair share.

Again, Trump being a prime example.

duga 01-12-2017 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1794548)
I don't think I could convince Goofle that it's "fair" but it's undeniably necessary to have a progressive tax code

Without one our economy can't even work as the middle class is an entirely artificial construct

progressive tax codes are the only reason capitalism doesn't exist in its natural 2 class state of have and have nots

I just don't understand the thinking. It's not like your tax dollars are being taken and the feds get a summer house. Your tax dollars are still going to things that are meant to benefit the tax payer. Instead of sitting in some kind of swiss bank account, the money will help keep a bridge from collapsing.

elphenor 01-12-2017 01:07 PM

I understand the thinking you have a right to the fruits of your labor it feels bad when you're really entitled to 60% of your labor

But this is without understanding the nature of profit and how it is in itself theft

A CEO makes a massive salary at the end of the day because he pays his workers a very small salary

duga 01-12-2017 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1794566)
I understand the thinking you have a right to the fruits of your labor it feels bad when you're really entitled to 60% of your labor

But this is without understanding the nature of profit and how it is in itself theft

That's what I mean. I get that it feels like your money is being taken away. It's not. That money is still going towards things the federal government thinks will benefit you. How they spend that money is up for debate, but that's it in a nutshell.

elphenor 01-12-2017 01:24 PM

Uh sort of but not necessarily

If you are in the 1% for instance nothing the gov does with your money directly benefits you, but it benefits the middle class who you depend on as your consumer base

The point really is that when you "make money" you didn't make anything you transferred wealth from the general economy into your savings account.

When you then spend that money is when you actually create wealth but if you are massively wealthy you don't spend that money at all and thus become a leech on everyone

Chula Vista 01-12-2017 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1794566)

A CEO makes a massive salary at the end of the day because he pays his workers a very small salary

And that CEO has a massive factory that requires infrastructure like stable electricity, running water, and paved roads throughout the community so people can drive to work. Your electric and water bills pay for consumption, not the infrastructure. That's tax dollars.


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