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Old 04-21-2014, 12:40 PM   #21 (permalink)
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..............and the New York Dolls by the Rolling Stones, so based on your logic the Rolling Stones could be the first punk band.
I never said that The Dolls were. I just said that they influenced The Pistols.

Punk has it's roots in '60s Garage Rock and Protopunk bands like The Stooges The MC5, The Velvet Underground, The Sonics, etc.
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Old 04-21-2014, 12:45 PM   #22 (permalink)
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I never said that The Dolls were. I just said that they influenced The Pistols.

Punk has it's roots in '60s Garage Rock and Protopunk bands like The Stooges The MC5, The Velvet Underground, The Sonics, etc.
I never said that you did it was just based on the logic that you've already put forward here. I was also making a reference that we can constantly go back and say this band and that band started a musical style.
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If you can't deal with the fact that there are 6+ billion people in the world and none of them think exactly the same that's not my problem. Just deal with it yourself or make actual conversation. This isn't a court and I'm not some poet or prophet that needs everything I say to be analytically critiqued.
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Old 04-21-2014, 12:48 PM   #23 (permalink)
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In fact, read the excellent book Please Kill Me: The Uncensored Oral History Of Punk. Not only is it a fantastic read, but it talks about how the New York Punks were pissed off because they felt that the British Punks ripped off their music their style, their attitude, and got all the credit for it.
So pissed off in fact that they all came flocking over to London as soon as it broke there trying to tour with all those bands they supposedly hated because there was so little going on where they were from.
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Old 04-21-2014, 01:25 PM   #24 (permalink)
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..............and the New York Dolls by the Rolling Stones, so based on your logic the Rolling Stones could be the first punk band.
..............and the Rolling Stones were influenced by Chuck Berry so by your logic Chuck Berry could be the first Punk.
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Old 04-21-2014, 01:26 PM   #25 (permalink)
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..............and the Rolling Stones were influenced by Chuck Berry so by your logic Chuck Berry could be the first Punk.
Not my logic, but the logic of the OP.
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If you can't deal with the fact that there are 6+ billion people in the world and none of them think exactly the same that's not my problem. Just deal with it yourself or make actual conversation. This isn't a court and I'm not some poet or prophet that needs everything I say to be analytically critiqued.
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Old 04-21-2014, 01:31 PM   #26 (permalink)
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They were both boy bands, one of them were just a little nicer.


Going with the Ramones for their music, which I still enjoy.

Sex Pistols definitely put on crazier shows and antics though.
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Old 04-21-2014, 01:48 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Not my logic, but the logic of the OP.
By that logic that isn't my logic but it's your logic which isn't really your logic but the OP's logic... did I get that right?
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Actually, I like you a lot, Nea. That's why I treat you like ****. It's the MB way.

"it counts in our hearts" ?ºº?
“I have nothing to offer anybody, except my own confusion.” Jack Kerouac.
“If one listens to the wrong kind of music, he will become the wrong kind of person.” Aristotle.
"If you tried to give Rock and Roll another name, you might call it 'Chuck Berry'." John Lennon
"I look for ambiguity when I'm writing because life is ambiguous." Keith Richards
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Old 04-21-2014, 01:57 PM   #28 (permalink)
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By that logic that isn't my logic but it's your logic which isn't really your logic but the OP's logic... did I get that right?
No
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If you can't deal with the fact that there are 6+ billion people in the world and none of them think exactly the same that's not my problem. Just deal with it yourself or make actual conversation. This isn't a court and I'm not some poet or prophet that needs everything I say to be analytically critiqued.
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Old 04-22-2014, 08:42 AM   #29 (permalink)
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The Ramones are a vaguely Punk forerunner band?p
Wasn't talking about the Ramones.

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You do know that The Pistols were influenced directly by The New York Dolls,
Yeah. And?

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and also by The Ramones, right?
How could they possibly have been influenced by the Ramones when they were around before the Ramones ever released a record? How could the Sex Pistols have been influenced by the Ramones when they didn't even know what they sounded like?

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Even if you want to take out the Protopunk bands, The Sex Pistols still didn't create Punk. In fact, read the excellent book Please Kill Me: The Uncensored Oral History Of Punk. Not only is it a fantastic read, but it talks about how the New York Punks were pissed off because they felt that the British Punks ripped off their music their style, their attitude, and got all the credit for it.
New York punks? You mean Blondie? Television? The Voidoids? If they want to pretend they're punk bands then more power to them. Maybe the Heartbreakers might count, but other than that... yeah. The punk movement was started in England. Period. Whatever band might happen to be the first band that ticked all the right musical boxes at the earliest possible time is almost beside the point, because without England they would have just been another isolated band that would have likely fallen by the wayside of history just like the Stooges, the New York Dolls, and the Velvet Underground (all bands that only really get retroactive notice because of punk).
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Old 04-22-2014, 11:27 AM   #30 (permalink)
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New York punks? You mean Blondie? Television? The Voidoids? If they want to pretend they're punk bands then more power to them. Maybe the Heartbreakers might count, but other than that... yeah. The punk movement was started in England. Period. Whatever band might happen to be the first band that ticked all the right musical boxes at the earliest possible time is almost beside the point, because without England they would have just been another isolated band that would have likely fallen by the wayside of history just like the Stooges, the New York Dolls, and the Velvet Underground (all bands that only really get retroactive notice because of punk).
You're wrong. Television didn't pretend to be Punk, probably didn't know what the genre was. Richard Lloyd just consider Television playing "street" music.

It's true the Punk "I'll spit in your face, jump up and down like a kid on a pogo stick, pin my clothes together with safety pins and wear S&M stuff" Rock started in England. But the music that became known as Punk evolved in the USA. Even the Rock and Roll that all UK band played has roots in America and like-wise American Folk had it's roots in the British Isle and Ireland. The UK and the US is really one country separated by the animosity of who started what.
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Actually, I like you a lot, Nea. That's why I treat you like ****. It's the MB way.

"it counts in our hearts" ?ºº?
“I have nothing to offer anybody, except my own confusion.” Jack Kerouac.
“If one listens to the wrong kind of music, he will become the wrong kind of person.” Aristotle.
"If you tried to give Rock and Roll another name, you might call it 'Chuck Berry'." John Lennon
"I look for ambiguity when I'm writing because life is ambiguous." Keith Richards
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